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Summary
Donald Trump stated that Palestinians displaced by Israel’s military actions would not have a right to return to Gaza under his plan.
Instead, he proposed resettling them in Egypt and Jordan, despite both nations rejecting the idea.
Trump suggested creating permanent refugee communities funded by the U.S., calling Gaza a “real estate development for the future.”
His proposal has drawn condemnation from Arab nations and legal experts, with the UN warning it could constitute ethnic cleansing and violate international law.
Israel’s far-right settlers welcomed the plan.
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Biden’s Gaza policy was tragic, but still, fuck anyone that voted to throw gas onto that fire.
Guy behind the Muslim ban, with the Christian nationalist base, was always going to make things worse.
What gas? Biden tried to do ethnic cleansing as well. Biden tried pushing Egypt to accept Israels ethnic cleansing plan behind closed doors and push the Palestinians out of Rafah. Egypt refused.
Biden helped Israel cleanse the West Bank. Do you believe they have right to return over there?
Trumps difference is he is saying the quiet part out loud. And all it does is piss off Egypt and Saudi.
You can’t reason with the pro-genocide Kamala voters
Oh fuck I didn’t realize there was a magical third candidate with a prospect of winning
Yeah, it’s those thoughts and prayers people keep sending in light of disaster. It’s great, you get to claim the moral high ground while burying your head in the sand about the realities of the situation.
I hope you look forward to voting for Ted Cruz, the Democratic candidate for president in 2028. After all, he’ll in theory be a little better than Trump running for his third term, so logically it’s our duty to support Mr. Cruz for president. The only criteria any Democrat is allowed to use is whether the Democratic candidate is a tiny bit better than the Republican.
If you refuse to vote for President Cruz, you will be fully morally responsible for any of Trump’s actions in his third term. After all, there’s no magical third candidate with a prospect of winning.
This is the moral hazard of the “vote blue no matter who” crowd. If the Democratic base is already locked in no matter what, then there’s no need for the party to work to actually reflect Democratic values. The people running the party only care about winning for the sake of winning. They don’t actually believe in anything; they’re just shameless power chasers. And if the Dem base will vote for literally anyone the Dems nominate, then Dems might as well just nominate Ted Cruz, Liz Cheney, or some other Republican. What better way to appeal to suburban Republican voters than by nominating an actual Republican?
The truth is that in order for the Democratic Party to actually mean anything, there have to be some people on the left side of the spectrum willing to walk away if the party moves too far to the right. If there’s no consequence to drifting to the right, the party will just become a duplicate of the Republican Party. Eventually we’ll just end up with an election between the KKK candidate and the skinhead candidate. That would literally be the outcome if every Democratic voter blindly “voted blue no matter who.”
Obviously, there’s the argument of voting to defend democracy. But the sad truth is that centrist dems have proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that they are actually incapable of defending democracy. You can’t run on something that you’ve proven yourself utterly incapable of doing. The party that appointed Merrick Garland could not credibly argue that they were going to vigorously defend democracy. Even now, their pathetic response to Trump’s lawlessness shows that they are incapable of fighting for democracy.
Dudes gonna single handedly start WW3
his handler in moscow deserves some credit
Trump is the handler in this case. Handling Putin’s balls.
Not even gonna try to pretend it isn’t ethnic cleansing…
People can weasel themselves around terms like “fascist” quite easily, because there are multiple definitions, many are very diffuse and there’s a lot of disagreement around it - but ethnic cleansing to my understanding is quite simple and this is it. Can any serious political commentator pretend it’s not? For example the forced removal of Poles from west Poland (annexed by USSR) after WW2 for example was not a slaughter, but is considered an act of ethnic cleansing.
Lmao. Enjoy Dearborn, Michigan. When he kicks you out, you can join them in limbo.
“But if the Dems ran a better candidate…”
“But Harris didn’t even stop in Dearborn, so it’s her fault not ours”
“Sure, everything Trump says is a lie, but at least he stopped here to lie to our faces. It’s the dem’s fault.”
“One of Trump’s first acts last time was a Muslim ban, but I can’t be arsed to remember that far back”
“I had to vote for this otherwise the dems wouldn’t learn anything”
/s
“we just had to teach the DNC a lesson at the polls during that specific election!!!”
Biden: I just have to aid genocide during an election year when I’m up against an absolute fascist.
Edit: cope and deal with it
Removed by mod
Is that not what happened? Lol
“Ooh I have a choice between genocide or genocide with extra fucking awful fascist bullshit. Which shall I choose? I know, I’ll go for the obviously worse option because I’m a good person” <— you
I voted dem, my state is blue, and we have a great local community. It’s been awful in Gaza long before trump. You can stand by whatever level of government funded genocide you want. There is nuance to voting, but not when I comes to aiding war crimes when you have complete power to stop sending munitions
Do you think the message got across to him? Did the DNC learn anything?
No, he’s a demented old man who broke many promises…like only running 1 term. That doesn’t mean you don’t say anything. It’s almost as if they are representing the will of the people…you need to show up and say something…like using your 1st amendment rights to organize and protest
Edit: fuck trump, his supporters & and anyone who can’t understand Biden’s role in giving the presidency back to trump. You can also add anyone in swing states that voted 3rd party/abstained
I’d like to earnestly suggest you reevaluate your strategy. Clearly threatening/withholding general election votes hasn’t been successful, and there’s obviously a lot of risk of negative outcomes like Trump winning. I think the general election is just too late in the process for a protest vote to mean anything.
I’m all for showing up and saying something, and I think pressure and threats during primary voting have worked in the past. I think we could have applied a LOT more pressure earlier in the process and might have had a better outcome. Now instead we have the worst possible result for the people of Palestine.
They did apply a lot of pressure during the primary. The total uncommitted in the Primary was 706,591 (Which may have been undercounted) which is absolutely massive for a primary. On average, general turnout is twice that of primary turnout. The Democratic Party knew that at they were risking at least 1.4 million votes by ignoring the issue. Here Are 34 Polls That Show A Ceasefire & Weapons Embargo Help Kamala Win. They also knew throughout the whole campaign that a vast majority of their constituents wanted weapons embargo and permanent ceasefire (required by domestic and international law), plus a majority of independents and Republicans. There was no valid reason for the Democratic Party to ignore the demands of that many voters, especially if trying to win an election
I wouldn’t hold my strategy at more fault that the DNC and it’s strategists. They’re the ones with a billion dollars at their disposal and it’s kind of their job to appeal to voters. People have needs and cutting off billions in “genocide-aid” seems like a no brainer. Countless opportunities to invoke the Leahy Act, win over more voters, and save some money.
…but I’m only a constituent, what do I know
Biden wasn’t the candidate.
Correct.
Kamala: I would do nothing different
She wouldn’t let a Palestinian speak at the DNC and pledged to do everything in her power to suck up to Netanyahu. There is so much cope here. There is no fucking difference between Biden, Kamala and Trump. They all suck off Satanyahu. The US is controlled by the Israel lobby. Mearsheimer has been screaming about this for 20 years.
Right, because Harris wanted to kick all of the Palestinians out so she could build a resort.
At least she and Biden attempted to negotiate peace.
🤡
You don’t make friends with genocide 🤷♂️
But if the Dems ran a better candidate…
This is completely valid criticism. Stop pretending it’s not. The DNC is in the habit of specifically going out of their way to choose unpopular pundits, and that’s not voters fault.
Voting for Trump, or not voting is their fault…
You clearly have no idea how US elections work at that level. The single candidate with the most votes wins. “Not Trump” was not a candidate.
If Trump gets 49% of the vote, Harris 48%, and “other” gets 3%, that’s not counted as 51% against Trump and he loses. That’s Trump winning with 49% of the vote.
Anyone who didn’t vote (or didn’t vote for the only candidate likely to defeat Trump) is responsible for his win.
Anyone who didn’t vote (or didn’t vote for the only candidate likely to defeat Trump) is responsible for his win.
Two things can be true at once. Voters not voting is bad, and it’s their fault. The DNC being incapable of finding pundits people want to vote for is also bad, and is also their fault. Pointing one out, has nothing to do with the other and both of these factors led to the election of Donald Trump not once, but TWICE.
Pointing out the DNC’s responsibility to find electable candidates doesn’t elevate the voters responsibility. But if the DNC were capable of finding pundits voters wanted to vote for no issue would exist. You wouldn’t have people refusing to vote, or voting for Trump out of some fucked up sense of “haha, I’m gonna stick it to you!”
Pretending like this issue is solely at the fault of the voters is so fucking disingenuous, disgusting and partyist its insane.
The DNC could have run an iguana wearing an offensive trucker hat, and we still should have voted for the iguana when Trump was the alternative or stood a chance of winning again.
It’s up to the voters to make smart choices, and some of them made the stupid choice.
The DNC could have run an iguana wearing an offensive trucker hat, and we still should have voted for the iguana when Trump was the alternative or stood a chance of winning again.
You don’t have to convince me of this. I completely agree. I’ve said only that the DNC has a responsibility to provide something better than an Iguana and for the past three election cycles, that’s what we’ve got and people are pissed. But every time you try to have meaningful discourse about how the DNC is only supplying Iguana people treat you like you’re some kind of turncoat who voted for Trump. And that’s just bullshit.
We need to be mad at non-voters, people who “lashed out” and voted for Trump, and people who let themselves be swept away by the lies of a grifter who we did nothing but warn them about. But we also need to be mad at the DNC… It’s not entirely the voters fault and fuck anyone who says it is.
You clearly have no idea how US elections work at that level. The single candidate with the most votes wins.
Which is exactly why in order to win an election, a campaign needs to offer concessions to voters to earn as many votes as possible.
Something the Democratic Party’s Campaign decisively chose not to do, and in fact do the opposite.
Instead of trying to secure hundreds of thousands to millions of constituents by supporting a permanent ceasefire and weapons embargo, a policy vastly supported by the Democrats own voter base (in addition to the majority of also independent and Republican voters), they instead alienated those voters by more than just ignoring their valid concerns.
They chose to arrest thousands of student protestors, gave billions of dollars to a genocide at the tax payers expense consistently for 15 months, actively suppressed the voices and representation of the main victims of the genocide, and campaigned with Liz Cheney (who was actively involved with the Bush-Cheney foreign policy in the middle east and enthusiastically pro ethnic cleansing of Palestinians). They chose to do all that instead of represent the view of the majority of their constituents and abide by domestic/international law.
And that was just one of the major issues, along with immigration and the economy, that tanked the approval of the Democratic Party. If the Democratic Party wanted to actually win against Trump they would have done everything to gain as many votes as possible. They chose not to. They threw the election and let an unpopular fascist win.
most electoral college votes. Less people voted for trump than did for Hillary in 2016, and he still won.
YOU do not seem to know how elections work beyond a single cycle. You view each election as singular isolated event, and you have zero perspective of the grander game that’s played between cycles.
What exactly do you think would happen if 100% of Dem voters always “voted blue no matter who?” If every Dem vote is already locked in from day one, what incentive does the party have to do anything to actually represent them? This is why the Dems worked so hard to court Republicans to vote for Harris. They figured that the Dem base was so scared of Trump that their votes were already locked in.
If you want a party to actually represent your beliefs, there have to be some people on your side willing to walk away if the party drifts too far out of line. If no Democratic voters are ever willing to abandon a Democrat for being too conservative, then the Dem candidates will drift further and further right each cycle.
Yes, there’s the idea of democracy being on the line, but when is democracy NOT going to be on the line? And truthfully, the Democratic leaders proved that they were not reliable stewards of Democracy. The party that nominated Garland had zero ability to argue that they would defend democracy. Just look at how limp-wristed the Democrats in Congress have been in responding to Trump’s lawlessness. These people are not capable of defending democracy. Trump should have been thrown in Gitmo on day one of the Biden administration. Instead Biden nominated a Republican to be his attorney general, and the rest is history.
“Democrats will ignore you if they can always count on your vote”
“Voting for the lesser of two evils is still voting for evil”
And idiotic absolutism is why we’re in this mess.
Good job!
Edit: If you meant the /s on your comment, my bad. There’s just so many insane takes going around, I kind of need that to differentiate.
/s…
Maybe I’m just getting whooshed here, but aren’t you and atzanteol saying the same thing? lol
Are they just getting downvoted because the forgot the “/s”?
Are we? I feel like that’s a pretty necessary “/s” considering the mental gymnastics I’ve heard IRL and on Lemmy. If they edit their comment to add that very necessary qualifier, I’ll happily throw 'em an upvote. As-is, I genuinely have no idea.
I for sure hear you on the insane takes flying around! From the context it looked pretty clear to me that they were tagging on to your post rather than trying to contradict it, but who knows.
Posting sarcasm about a controversial topic without a “/s” tag is like fucking without a condom… it carries a risk, but sometimes you just gotta do what feels right!
our best bet was in the primaries in 2020. from there it’s all been about our best opportunities to keep trump away from power regardless. i know america sucks. i live here, too. but to act like voting for the lesser of two evils in a binary choice election was worse than letting trump have power is to dissengage from the fact that this is america. this is how the system is stacked against us. you don’t get to just magically not be part of it because you don’t like it. there was nothing stopping you from organizing resistance under kamala. but there’s plenty of violence under trump that’s making it hard to organize.
I mean Jordan said recently that they’d consider pushing refugees across their border an act of war. Trump’s “plan”, if it can even be called that, doesn’t include a realistic way to bring about all this. I think I represent a good number of Muslims when I way: Fuck him, but it ain’t happening.
Trump wants to own hotels and resorts in a razed and reconstructed Gaza. Do you think he cares where the Palestinians go? Do you think the rest of the world will want to look more deeply into it if he just says “they’ve been relocated, no I won’t tell you to where”?
He’s presenting a Palästinenserproblem. People should be watching very carefully.
Do you think the rest of the world will want to look more deeply into it if he just says “they’ve been relocated, no I won’t tell you to where”?
Well, I do suspect the EU will be more than a little miffed about it. Not enough to come to blows, but probably enough to sanction Israel. That said, that is secondary to the real problem with Trump’s plan: There’s no way the Arab states will agree to this. Assuming he does start exterminating Gazans they’ll flee to Israel, Jordan and Egypt, and while the IDF will be able to keep them from from crossing the border (mostly by killing everything that moves), it’s impossible to expect that of Egyptian and Jordanian soldiers. Gazans will cross over into these two countries, which will lead to a collapse of the peace treaties between them and Israel. Also on the home front, the outrage at all this just might be the last straw that gets an Arab head of state assassinated or lead to some kind of regime change. The former has precedent; this is what got Anwar El-Sadat. Now there’s a very real chance that Egypt, Syria and/or Jordan declare war over this, but even if they don’t this will isolate Israel in the region in a way it hasn’t been in decades. Even if Trump is okay with that, the Israeli government sure as hell isn’t. That’s what will ultimately throw a wrench into the whole thing.
People immigrating to the US? Criminal invaders. The biggest threat to America. Meanwhile, let’s turn an entry country into refugees and forcibly relocate them into other countries without the consent of anyone involved. Makes perfect sense. /s
"I’M PROTEST VOTING. " - Dumb Bastards
The sheer audacity of treating sovereign territories like Monopoly properties reveals the bankruptcy of modern geopolitics. Trump’s alleged “Gaza swap” proposal – offering Egypt debt relief for absorbing a war-torn enclave – reeks of casino diplomacy where human lives become bargaining chips. This isn’t statecraft, it’s a foreclosure auction on human dignity.
Egypt’s immediate rejection proves even authoritarian regimes recognize some lines shouldn’t be crossed. But the real tragedy lies in normalizing this billionaire’s mentality that every crisis is a leveraged buyout opportunity. From the Abraham Accords to this Gaza garage sale, it’s all about transactional trophy deals while ignoring root causes.
The Mediterranean doesn’t need another real estate mogul playing Risk with refugee camps. This isn’t solving conflict – it’s outsourcing oppression through financial blackmail. The message is clear: human rights have become adjustable-rate mortgages in the hands of dealmakers.
Hey CNN, wanna interview those protest voters again?
Do you respect Palestinians or not?
This is such a thought terminating question being posed in bad faith.
You can respect and support the Palestinian people, and still realize that Harris was the best option for the Palestinians we had on the table. To not vote was giving a vote to trump, and trump is significantly worse than Harris for the Palestinians, this is objective truth, we have the facts in front of us right now.
Not voting was essentially voting against the Palestinian people.
Is it fair that we had the choices we had in November? No.
But the protest vote just turned into voting for this century’s Mussolini and a guy who’s doing his damnedest to start WW3.
Which seems…antithetical to the purpose of the protest vote? So who really won here?
I voted for Harris, but I also recognize the great value of people refusing to vote for a Democratic candidate when they move too far to the right. If there is no consequence for drifting right, the candidates will continue to do so.
The whole “preserve democracy” thing sounds good if you don’t think about it too hard, but it doesn’t hold up to scrutiny. The Biden/Harris team proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that they weren’t capable of defending democracy. Nominating Garland proved that. The dems pathetic response to Trump’s current lawlessness has proven that.
You can’t “defend democracy” just by saying the words “defend democracy.” You actually have to do it. And they proved that they were either unwilling or incapable of actually defending democracy. That’s why that talking point so fell flat.
Long story short, when people are hungry and broke and without a place to live, they become desperate, but then when you do something that really makes them angry. They stop being desperate and they start becoming violent. Not just people in the Middle East mind you I’m talking all people from British colonists to French students yelling about revolution all the way down to Germans, who survived the World War I only to see part of their country, giving away the treaty of Versailles. 
 Donald Trump‘s plan is just asking for further acts of terrorism against America and our interest overseas
I feel sorry for any service member who is killed because Donald Trump wants to build another hotel that will inevitably go bankrupt 
I feel sorry for any service member who is killed because Donald Trump wants to build another hotel that will inevitably go bankrupt
I don’t. If Trump ends up sending troops to Gaza (which is bordering on impossible mind you), then those troops will frankly deserve whatever happens to them.
I was in the army for 10 years and can tell you that on an average unit about 50 to 60% of those guys don’t agree with the president’s policy or the plan of action. But they’re there because they assumed that the person elected to be president would have the countries best interest at heart. That assumption has not really worked out.
So yeah, you can say that soldiers and marines getting killed in action will get what they deserve but to me I think we need to take a moment and hold our leaders accountable first. And as far as I’m concerned all the crooked shit Donald Trump is done the punishment. His face is being kicked off Twitter for a couple of months. 
What is this thing? And why? 
What’s the end goal here, cause another 9/11 so he can declare martial law?
Probably say “I gave them a chance, now we need to exterminate, since we have no other options”
I said something similar a few months before he got into office, got down voted to hell.
Hey but at least all those enlightened dipshits didn’t vote for Kamala! Who could have guessed that Trump’s Palestine policy would be even worse?? Oh yeah, everyone else. Thanks a lot dipshits
Biden suggests to move Palestinian to Egypt and Jordan as early as October 2023. So did previous US administration it goes back to 80s.
Saying the quite part out load is what is different now and the Democrats pretend they are upset while Both Kamala and Biden saying their proud Zionist.
What is now different is that Trump want the place for himself not for Israel nor the US.
Bidens suggestion was explicitly about allowing Palestinians to flee into Egypt short term instead of being forced to flee repeatedly within the country.
Trying to equate the two is quite disingenuous.
If you actually believe they would have been allowed back after, I have a Riviera to sell you.
Biden (and Trump’s) proposed plan all line up pretty nicely with these leaked documents from the Israeli government. https://www.972mag.com/intelligence-ministry-gaza-population-transfer/
The document unequivocally and explicitly recommends transferring Palestinian civilians from Gaza as the desired outcome of the war
The transfer plan is divided into several stages. In the first stage, action must be taken so that the population of Gaza “evacuates south,” while the air strikes focus on the northern Gaza Strip
The document also says that the United States should be enlisted in the process to exert pressure on Egypt to absorb the Palestinian residents of Gaza, and that other European countries — particularly Greece and Spain — as well as Canada should help absorb and settle the Palestinian refugees.
The Intelligence Ministry document states that Egypt will have an “obligation under international law to allow the passage of the population,” and that the United States can contribute to the process by “exerting pressure on Egypt, Turkey, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, and the UAE to contribute to the initiative, either with resources or with the absorption of displaced persons.”
Bidens suggestion was explicitly about allowing Palestinians to flee into Egypt short term
Just how gullible are you? When has any expulsion or relocation of Palestinians out of a territory ever been temporary? Biden isn’t a complete moron. He would know as well as anyone that there is no such thing as a temporary relocation of Palestinians.
People don’t follow news and ignore it then come back making statement that proven wrong and shove it in everyone face.
Reality every person who read history or watch news knows for fact that when it comes to Israel US position has been consistent.
Blaming Palestinians who said “fuck this party that want our vote and continue to kill our families” even though it has proven they reason Kamala lost is Economy.
Continuing this fake narrative outright racist at best.
Reminds me how they kept downvoting people who dispute the numbers of people killed in October 7 which, also proven to be around 800 at best and proven the Israel ordered their soldier to use the Hannibal directive of bombing vehicles regardless who is inside.
Predictable, but even so.
So… More concentration camps?
Mexico is currently building the deepest hole in the world!
It’s part of the plan to toss all my fellow Mexicans in the hole, then we’ll rename the Mexican Riviera to the American Riviera. The Yucatán peninsula will now be “Extraflorida” or southflorida.
Yeah, I see where all this is going. Eventually well have east America … Land rich in diamonds.
Big shocker!
