They only jail people outside of the in-group

I see.

Unbelievable that fucking guy or lady said that and got any upvotes. Living under a goddamn fucking rock. Thank you for correcting.

A genuine, actual answer is that when you’re being attacked, it is incredibly rare for a police officer to be standing there, ready to intervene. In life-or-death situations the police really only exist to take a report from whoever is left standing, and potentially make an arrest. There’s plenty of people out there who don’t have the strength to defend themselves in hand-to-hand combat, and even if they did, next to nobody has the skills necessary to reliably defend against a knife attack using their bare hands. That’s just plain how knife attacks work.

You can counter this with statistics that show that access to guns increases injuries and deaths, because they absolutely do, but pro-gun folks put the individual before the group on this issue. The individual, in their mind, should have the right to quick deadly force in order to facilitate defense of their own life, and other’s failure to handle that responsibility is not their problem and/or the price of that right.

There are always tradeoffs, in any policy you set for society. If you go the other direction there will be people who are victimized who would otherwise have been able to defend themselves. Which scenario is worse? How many victims of one type are worth victims of the other?

Well, you know, the more guns, the less gun violence. Yeeeeeeah, right. Since we officially have more guns than people, it should all be over soon.

Tyranny, or something I believe is the argument.

Especially after the murdering was already done.

Jeez, that’s a lot of words you needed to make a clown out of yourself, just because you are pissed by objective fact.

I recall reading like a gunman got tackled last year. If I get time I’ll dig it up

Not what I said or implied, but no, that chance is not basically zero.

How many of those 12 citizens that stopped the attacker had that happen too?

Personally I don’t think it’s worth sacrificing the clarity of the image with even more rare specifics.

Would anyone you know tell you if they carried a knife for self-defense, given that it’s generally a crime to do so in the UK?

Imo only an idiot would carry a knife for self-defence, especially if untrained. If someone (probably women especially) feels unsafe, carrying CS-spray would be more reasonable imo.

It wouldn’t be wrong if someone wanted a knife for self defense though

Almost all of our gun violence is the same, gang/drug related. The media here acts like it’s random killings all over the place, its not. You have a better chance of drowning in a pool than getting killed by an ar15 here, yet people, even in this thread, think it’s something that happens like every 3 seconds.

I’d feel fine with someone carrying a weapon if it’s based on a reasonable fear, and they make an effort to stay trained/safe with the weapon. For instance, they exited an abusive relationship with a significant other who feels they “belong” to them.

But there’s a lot of people who stretch the statement of “I don’t feel safe” to far more cases than make sense.

“you can keep the crack, this one actually did something”

we need good kids with guns to shoot the neutral kids with guns who might take someone else out when they shoot themselves.

Ah, the classic no true good guy fallacy.

Homicidal ideation does not always equate to wanting to live with having killed someone, and a lot of these people are closer to normal than they realize until they are facing potential consequences for their actions. I would posit that killing oneself after doing something so heinous is one of the saner outcomes.

A lot of people experience “fucked around, found out” immediately or shortly after they cross a line, before anyone else has a chance to tell them they fucked up.

Thanks for clarifying. My point was not to ilicit sympathy, any such violence is ahorant and the perpetrator must take responsibility, ultimately, but rather to illicit empathy. To understand how and why people end up in such a place then creates the starting point to find solutions, or at least, minimise how frequently they may occur within a population in the future.

As such, I’m inclined to think that in at least some of the cases where the individual commits suicide once the police turn up, they have reached a total breaking point, so to speak, and the last option they can see has gone so suicide is sll that’s left.

This to me doesn’t suggest a ‘bad’ person, more so someone who has found themselves in a terrible place, particularly in cases where that’s no fault of their own, and are wndingvup doing something bad. Being ‘bad’ to me is closer to gansta/mobster mentality - e.g. killing people is fine, so long as its not us, and i cant imagine any mass shooter being someone like that. There are a myriad of variables of course, and this may only apply to some of the people painted as ‘bad’ in this infografic.

Check out theboxotruth.com. They’ve tested all sorts of ammunition against all sorts of barriers.

Rifle bullets are relatively small, lightweight, and fast. When they impact building materials, they tend to shatter. They’re dangerous on the other side of the first wall, but they’ll lose a lot more energy a lot faster.

Pistol bullets, buckshot, slugs, etc are relatively large, heavy, and slow. They tend to remain intact and carry more energy through multiple walls.

A lot of law enforcement agencies switched their long guns from pistol-caliber carbines to 5.56 rifles specifically because they over penetrate less.

55gr FMJ BT–which is pretty much the most common .223 ammunition–tends to fragment pretty dramatically inside about 300y after hitting something solid. Once it hits something solid, it starts tumbling and tears itself apart pretty fast, in part because it’s moving at supersonic speeds. That’s part of the reason why it’s so lethal at short ranges; it’s turning into a lot of small fragments… (That, and the cavitation that is produced by bullets moving >2600fps; that will produce a temporary wound cavity that exceeds the elasticity of tissue, and turns into a permanent wound cavity. The cavitation produced by subsonic bullets isn’t great enough to turn into a permanent wound channel.) At subsonic speeds, it doesn’t fragment, and just ‘ice picks’. A shotgun with birdshot would definitely not over penetrate, but then you run the risk of not being adequately lethal on your target. Buckshot is still going to penetrate exterior walls pretty handily without being deformed significantly or fragmenting, even if a lot of the energy has been eaten up by a house’s cladding; it might not kill easily, but it can still wound. But then you’re back to the original problem: large/long firearm, heavy recoil, very limited ammunition in a tube magazine, and slow to reload.

You know that AR doesn’t stand for assault rifle, right? The AR is for Armalite, the inventors of the design. It’s just a semiautomatic rifle with a detachable magazine, it’s pretty common to use as a hunting rifle.

And yeah, you see AR-15 and it’s workalikes all over the place because they’re flexible. Literally the most common rifle in the US. That’s why they’re so common in public mass shootings - those shooters generally aren’t buying a gun specifically for that sort of shooting, they’re using a gun they already have access to or what they can readily purchase off the shelf.

It’s not the best gun for any scenario, but it’s a good enough gun for most and that’s because it’s modular and the guns and parts are both commonly available.

Folding stock shotgun is actually terrible, you could practice for years and still be less accurate than a cop with a proper stock on their firearm.

Have you ever fired a gun while under time pressure? Like, for instance, in a 3 gun competition? Or shot at someone while they’re shooting at you? Misses in combat are common. Would you rather miss a lot with a firearm that only carries 7 bullets, or one that has 30?

Oh, and before you spread some fudd about shotguns pellets spreading and not needing to aim, at home defense distances–<10y–your shot pattern with no choke on a 30" barrel with 00 buckshot is going to be about 4". Firing a shotgun without it being braced on your shoulder? Good fucking luck hitting anything. And your shotgun is still going to be about half again as long-at a minimum–than a carbine.

If he’s a terrorist he’s clearly not a real white guy, he’s probably Italian or Irish or something