The Israeli human rights group B’Tselem has published a major new report documenting how the Israeli prison system has become “a network of torture camps,” where physical, psychological and sexual abuse of Palestinian prisoners is normalized and routine.
The report, titled “Welcome to Hell,” collects the testimony of 55 Palestinians who were detained by Israeli authorities since October 7 and later released, almost all without charges. This comes as a group of U.N. experts condemned the widespread torture of Palestinians and as Israel’s Channel 12 News aired shocking footage of Israeli soldiers sexually abusing a prisoner at the Sde Teiman army base, where thousands of detainees from Gaza are held.
Sarit Michaeli, the international advocacy lead for B’Tselem, says the abuse in Israeli prisons is “systemic, ongoing and state-sanctioned,” reflecting the cruelty and thirst for revenge among a growing number of Israelis. “They would like to have a completely open field in terms of what they can do to Palestinians,” says Michaeli.
You can find the full report of testimonies here
People born in Germany are given citizenship. Zainichi Koreans are not in Japan. There is no accelerated procedure for zainichi Koreans who went to school. In fact japanese law even makes it harder for Korean schoolchildren.
Not in general, no.
If your argument was “Japan should adopt German-style laws and give citizenship to children of permanent residents” then I’d say yes, that’s a good idea. Your argument, however, is “Japan has Apartheid, Zainichi can’t use the same beaches as Japanese, are forced to live in segregated areas, have a different set of laws applied to them”. Because that is what Apartheid means. You’re trivialising the concept with your accusation.
My argument is nobody cares about apartheid or even potential apartheid countries Japan is not the only one. They act like there is no problem it’s all normal. You don’t see a single person here going hey yeah Japan should chill out everyone is just going “no it’s not”.
What are you talking about “in general, no.”
It is how it works since the year 2000. If you are born there yes, you can get citizenship, given your parent live there for 8 years.
There are generations of zainichi who have not got citizenship.
I’ve shown they have different sets of laws that apply to them. They are prohibited from working various jobs.
I mentioned several things Japan should change. How is that “acting like there’s no problem”?
What I’m saying it’s not Apartheid. Because it isn’t. Apartheid is a specific thing with a specific definition.
I mean “in general, no”. If a pregnant couple travels to the US on a tourist visa and gives birth there, the child will be a US citizen. That’s not the case in Germany or for that matter most of the rest of the world. Korea itself doesn’t have Ius soli.
Living here doesn’t suffice, you need permanent residency – though if you’re here for that long, that should generally be the case. And it’s not “you can become a citizen” but “you are a citizen”. If you don’t grow up in Germany with that kind of Ius soli citizenship you’ll have to choose with 21 whether you keep your foreign or German citizenship.
That kind of regime is btw what I proposed Japan introduce in my previous comment. You might want to start reading what I write.
And Japan should make the procedure easier for them. I have said that already. But that doesn’t mean that they’re treated any differently from any other non-citizen. They in fact do enjoy some rights not afforded to other permanent residents. So, yes, those “different laws” exist, but they’re in the favour of Zainichis.
Go and have a look at actual Apartheid regimes. The degree of discrimination, the complete impossibility of leaving second-class citizen status, the lot of it. Noone is going to listen to your demands for better citizenship laws if you keep on pretending Zainichis can’t shop in the same 7/11s that the rest of Japan shops in.
20% of the Israeli citizens are Palestine descent. 2 million Palestinian citizens of Israel.
Yeah, their laws I pointed out to you on how schools operate realllly favour zainichi Koreans. /s Incase you need it
What about the occupied territories? They’re applying martial law there, and people have no prospect of citizenship. Then there’s plenty of Palestinans living in Israel who don’t have Israeli citizenship, or realistic prospect of citizens, e.g. in Jerusalem.
You have no idea how bad it is in Israel if you think it’s in any way comparable to Japan.
I’m sorry are you saying that Japan should introduce Korean native-level lessons in their state school curriculum or what’s your actual issue here. What would you change. I’ve yet to see any actual policy proposal from you: No solutions, just “Japan bad”. Why would Zainichi who don’t speak Korean want those types of schools.
Point me at a state and I’ll find several things that they should change. Do you e.g. really want to get me started on Korea with their rampant gerontocracy and misogyny.
Crucially, though, and this should make you think, none of what I said Japan should change actually came from an argument you made.
Africans themselves have criticized Japan for apartheid.
Miss me with whatever antisemitic you are ignorantly and bigantly spreading.
Have you actually read the corresponding section in Chapter 1. Quote:
Have you any idea how many countries traded with South Africa at that time? Not exactly the same thing but here’s a map of SA’s diplomatic ties at the time. Plenty of African states, say Madagascar or the Congo, were happy to take South African money. What does anything have to do with the status of Zainichi a whole 50 years later?
Yes I read it all. It shows a pattern for Japan which openly embraces apartheid up to recent times. They support that crap. Just like the congo did. In fact the congo like Japan was also an apartheid during those relations.
You admitted they have several things to change after 2 days of arguing with you about it. Lol.
Yeah pretty much, if they genuinely cared about human rights violations they would look into the Apartheid reports by Amnesty, B’TSelem, or HRW with the same earnest as Japan’s human rights violations during WWII and their current discriminatory policies.
The argument is again: people don’t give a shit about any other apartheid countries. It’s only antisemites who use the word.
It’s funny because the other day you tried showing me a map that started in 1945(6 years after WW2 started) portraying some completely bs ethnic cleansing commencing before the Palestinians got 8 countries to invade and attempt to destroy Israel.
Then
You proceeded to list to me discriminatory practices Israel allegedly did against those people up until today.
Alright dude.
Again, your argument makes literally no sense. If you read the actual reports describing in detail every aspect, from law to practice, of Apartheid in Israel, you would understand the reality of Apartheid both codified in law and practiced on-the-ground.
Second, stop acting like criticism of Israel committing crimes against humanity and settler Colonialism is antisemitic. Anti-zionism is not antisemitism. Israel, and their actions, has not and never will represent all Jewish people. Jewish people who criticize Zionism, which has been the case since it’s inception, are not antisemitic or ‘self-hating jews.’ This conflation is genuinely antisemitic, and promotes actual antisemitism. Nazis love that conflation, because they can point at Israel and contribute all their crimes against humanity to the entirety of all Jewish people. Which is completely ridiculous. So stop with the conflation.
Third, yes, because the ethnic cleansing of the native Palestinian population has been central to Zionism, a Settler Colonialist ideology, since the late 1800’s. This is not conjecture, this is historical fact researched in depth by many historians, many even Israeli, with many sources, including official declassified Israeli documents.
You have a completely revisionist understanding of the history of Palestine. I suggest you try to prove yourself wrong by reading some works by historians if you feel so certain about what you think you know.
The Concept of Transfer 1882-1948 - Nur Masalha
A History of Modern Palestine - Ilan Pappe
The Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine - Ilan Pappe
The Biggest Prison on Earth: A History of the Occupied Territories - Ilan Pappe
The Hundred Years’ War on Palestine - Rashid Khalidi
The 1967 Arab-Israeli War: Origins and Consequences - Avi Shlaim
The Gaza Strip: The Political Economy of De-development - Sara Roy
New Historian Aricles on One vs. Two State Solution:
How Avi Shlaim moved from two-state solution to one-state solution
‘One state is a game changer’: A conversation with Ilan Pappe
There is no ethnic cleansing when that ethnic population in the area went from 500k to 5 million.
You say this ethnic cleansing started in the late 1800s? You are the one with a completely revisionist idea of history. When Jews immigrated to the area in the late 1800s they were first met with hostility towards them. Their land often pillaged by Arab marauders. All while they were starving and struggling to carry water on camel back to their settlement.
There was no settler colonialism in the late 1800s. Even the first wave of settlers faced hostility from the Palestine-Arabs.
They’ve made it their own prison even before they attempted to invade and destroy Israel on 1948.
Ethnic Cleansing is about displacement first and foremost, please read the definition before you try to argue against it. Population growth isn’t antithetical to ethnic cleansing. The poverty is deliberately caused by the occupation in the OPT. The link between poverty and population growth are well known. Hostility towards the new Zionist settlers only arose due to the expulsions.
The Concept of forcible transfer the native Palestinians population was central to Zionism since the 1880s when Palestine was chosen as the location. During the British Mandate, around a 100,000 Palestinians were forcibly displaced by land purchases (unlike previous land purchases, where peasants would normally continue working and living on the land). Ben-Gurion used Partition as a tactic to dissuade the British from considering a Bi-National Secular State, and instead create a causi-belli for the beginning of a Jewish ethnostate within Palestine. The Nakba, or Plan Dalet, was deliberately planned for over a year. That ethnic cleansing campaign is directly responsible for the Palestinian Occupied Territories of East Jerusalem, the West Bank, and Gaza. The 1967 war was a deliberate tactic for Israel to take control of those areas and begin the never ending occupation, once those policies were practiced on the Palestinian population that remained in the Green Line after the Nakba.
Transfer Committee and the JNF led to Forced Displacement of 100,000 Palestinians throughout the mandate.
1967 war: Haaretz, Forward
Israel Martial Law and Defence (Emergency) Regulations practiced in the occupied territories after 1967
Take a break from arguing with strangers on the Internet about how it’s actually the Palestinians fault for being ethnically cleansed. If you’re genuinely interested in the history go read the works of historians, I’ve already referenced plenty.
That’s nice for you. How can one take you anti-semites seriously when you say “there is no apartheid in Japan.” Africans themselves have criticized Japan for apartheid.
There was no mass displacement from evem the first 100 settlers(Rishon L’Zion) who themselves faced hostility from the local Arabs 30 years before any British mandate. The overwhelming majority of Palestinians are descendants of that preexisting Arab population before any British mandate.
The way they treated those people. Now look where they are. They’ll continue to prosper(just like they let Palestine people after everything that people done to them).
I won’t stop spreading the pro-semetic word. I’m well read in history everything I say has sources to back it up, I list few .gov sources throughout this thread. The source in this comment there is a government site.