Biden already worked under someone who had no problem killing US civilians Source. That escaped prosecution because it was an official act despite it being a clearly criminal act 18 U.S. Code § 1119
Didn’t Obama also kick out more illegal immigrants than a bunch of presidents before him? Maybe I’m misremembering, but I do remember nobody giving a shit about illegal immigrants being kicked out. Then Trump came and people freaked out, as if it didn’t happen under Obama as well.
Obama was literally known as deporter-in-chief and he deported more in his in either of his terms than Trump did in his four years Source. But be careful some smart ass is probably gonna start screaming you can’t say both sides, and you’re a foreign asset trying to depress the vote because they can’t be bothered to read.
From my perspective it was less about the numbers and more about how vocal Trump was about his intentions. Add to that the family separation policy and the STILL MISSING children when he’s a known associate of Epstien there was plenty to be upset about.
So you claim that Trump is objectively worse because he was vocal rather than Obama doing it on a muted basis? Despite Obama doing substantially higher numbers? That is definitely some take on these set of facts.
No, I’m saying just looking at the numbers doesn’t tell the whole story and intentions also play a large role. Trump wanted to do more than he did but was hindered in many ways. He still did untold damage to our immigration systems and irreparably damaged hundreds of families. It’s really difficult to explain a concept as vast as this without essentially writing a book, and that isn’t my strong suit.
I’m perfectly okay with Obama also being a bad guy here, but he didn’t publicly dehumanize immigrants and their families. He also didn’t advocate for removing legal residents based solely on their demographic information.
I hate to use this term but you are literally arguing against facts with only feelings; feelings based on comments that arguably amount to mere puffery. My argument is that there is no good guys here, but it appears you are stuck on the point that Trump was worse for undocumented individuals because of feelings, rather than an actual objective measure like numbers.
I can understand why you would think that and I agree that I’m not providing much factual information to work with. I’m not really trying to win an argument here. I was attempting to suggest that relying purely on one data set without considering the wider political and social context is a poor way to form an opinion.
I have a hard time clearly communicating my thoughts and tone via text, but please believe that I mean no disrespect. That being said, bringing up Obama’s numbers in a discussion about Trump is quite literally excusing Trump’s attempted atrocities because someone else was “worse” in your chosen metric. My position is that numbers don’t always tell the whole story.
Wow, I have no clue how you thought this fact was enough to argue against “Trump is objectively worse than Obama”.
Trump is by far, and I mean by an unreal margin, the WORST human being to ever hold the seat of President of the United States of America. There is no debate that Trump is objectively the worst.
Now sure some people did some things more than others. That’s true for everything. Obama deporting illegal immigrants is nothing like the racism and hatred towards racialized Americans has stoked on the last 8 years. An illegal immigrant KNOWS their number could be up at any time, it’s not a hateful act to legally deport them. But now, EVERY minority in the US, and all women, know their number might get called at any time, and that’s a fear that no lawful citizen deserves.
thanks for sharing that. i was not aware of it. it’s particularly brutal that the link is fact checking ron desantis of all people, but i guess it’s not impossible for a republican to say something true on occasion (even if by accident).
i thought this quote from the link was particularly damning:
But did Trump deport fewer people than Obama? There are different deportation metrics, and Obama surpassed Trump’s numbers in each one.
The short answer is that Trump said that the President can’t be held accountable for criminal acts done while in office, and the Supreme Court agreed. I believe he went as far as to say that the President is immune to prosecution for having political opponents assassinated, but I can’t remember if that’s true or not. Regardless, the implication here is that Biden should do whatever is necessary to prevent another Trump presidency since he has presidential immunity.
Lol, is joke. An account named UniversalMonk used to be notorious for pretending not to understand subtlety to get people to state rule breaking things explicitly, after which that person could be reported/banned.
I thought it was funny for a while, but ended up blocking the account, so I’m not sure if it’s still active
I do find myself missing the subtle points of comments, esp in the more lefty areas of the fediverse. I hope I’m not breaking any rules when I ask. I am genuinely interested.
No, you’re not! It’s just that the comment you replied to may have been alluding to violence, so if they clarified that explicitly in response to your question, they could be reported
Yeah, I get that much, but I’m not sure what the implication of the original comment is.
Like, are they implying Biden should call a hit on Trump? Should he just not cede the presidency? These are things the typical Lemmy user (as I’ve seen at least) would RAGE against under any other circumstances, so I’m inclined to assume thats not the case. But if not that, then what?
Another wild thought: Biden could test the limits of presidential immunity.
Joe Biden should see if squatters rights extend to the White House.
I’ve been wondering how hilarious it would be if they pulled a Trump and just nope and say Kamala is the president.
Biden already worked under someone who had no problem killing US civilians Source. That escaped prosecution because it was an official act despite it being a clearly criminal act 18 U.S. Code § 1119
Didn’t Obama also kick out more illegal immigrants than a bunch of presidents before him? Maybe I’m misremembering, but I do remember nobody giving a shit about illegal immigrants being kicked out. Then Trump came and people freaked out, as if it didn’t happen under Obama as well.
Shit was weird.
Obama was literally known as deporter-in-chief and he deported more in his in either of his terms than Trump did in his four years Source. But be careful some smart ass is probably gonna start screaming you can’t say both sides, and you’re a foreign asset trying to depress the vote because they can’t be bothered to read.
From my perspective it was less about the numbers and more about how vocal Trump was about his intentions. Add to that the family separation policy and the STILL MISSING children when he’s a known associate of Epstien there was plenty to be upset about.
So you claim that Trump is objectively worse because he was vocal rather than Obama doing it on a muted basis? Despite Obama doing substantially higher numbers? That is definitely some take on these set of facts.
No, I’m saying just looking at the numbers doesn’t tell the whole story and intentions also play a large role. Trump wanted to do more than he did but was hindered in many ways. He still did untold damage to our immigration systems and irreparably damaged hundreds of families. It’s really difficult to explain a concept as vast as this without essentially writing a book, and that isn’t my strong suit.
I’m perfectly okay with Obama also being a bad guy here, but he didn’t publicly dehumanize immigrants and their families. He also didn’t advocate for removing legal residents based solely on their demographic information.
I hate to use this term but you are literally arguing against facts with only feelings; feelings based on comments that arguably amount to mere puffery. My argument is that there is no good guys here, but it appears you are stuck on the point that Trump was worse for undocumented individuals because of feelings, rather than an actual objective measure like numbers.
I can understand why you would think that and I agree that I’m not providing much factual information to work with. I’m not really trying to win an argument here. I was attempting to suggest that relying purely on one data set without considering the wider political and social context is a poor way to form an opinion.
I have a hard time clearly communicating my thoughts and tone via text, but please believe that I mean no disrespect. That being said, bringing up Obama’s numbers in a discussion about Trump is quite literally excusing Trump’s attempted atrocities because someone else was “worse” in your chosen metric. My position is that numbers don’t always tell the whole story.
Wow, I have no clue how you thought this fact was enough to argue against “Trump is objectively worse than Obama”.
Trump is by far, and I mean by an unreal margin, the WORST human being to ever hold the seat of President of the United States of America. There is no debate that Trump is objectively the worst.
Now sure some people did some things more than others. That’s true for everything. Obama deporting illegal immigrants is nothing like the racism and hatred towards racialized Americans has stoked on the last 8 years. An illegal immigrant KNOWS their number could be up at any time, it’s not a hateful act to legally deport them. But now, EVERY minority in the US, and all women, know their number might get called at any time, and that’s a fear that no lawful citizen deserves.
You expanded the scope of the discussion (that you weren’t involved in at that) just to get yourself upset.
thanks for sharing that. i was not aware of it. it’s particularly brutal that the link is fact checking ron desantis of all people, but i guess it’s not impossible for a republican to say something true on occasion (even if by accident).
i thought this quote from the link was particularly damning:
Grandpa’s got a rifle, Grandpa’s got a scope, Grandpa sees you winning, Grandpa blasts a NOPE.
I don’t follow what you’re implying with this. Can you explain what you mean?
The short answer is that Trump said that the President can’t be held accountable for criminal acts done while in office, and the Supreme Court agreed. I believe he went as far as to say that the President is immune to prosecution for having political opponents assassinated, but I can’t remember if that’s true or not. Regardless, the implication here is that Biden should do whatever is necessary to prevent another Trump presidency since he has presidential immunity.
That he’s immune to democratic elections
So are a hundred million others
UniversalMonk, is that you?
I tend to prefer monk class for DND and other TTRPGs, but no, I’ve never gone by that user name.
Lol, is joke. An account named UniversalMonk used to be notorious for pretending not to understand subtlety to get people to state rule breaking things explicitly, after which that person could be reported/banned.
I thought it was funny for a while, but ended up blocking the account, so I’m not sure if it’s still active
Interesting.
I do find myself missing the subtle points of comments, esp in the more lefty areas of the fediverse. I hope I’m not breaking any rules when I ask. I am genuinely interested.
No, you’re not! It’s just that the comment you replied to may have been alluding to violence, so if they clarified that explicitly in response to your question, they could be reported
Here’s an article from 2023 where trump discusses pardoning himself.
https://www.cnn.com/2023/09/14/politics/donald-trump-pardon/index.html
Here’s an article from 2021 where trump discusses pardoning himself.
https://www.npr.org/2021/01/09/955087860/can-trump-pardon-himself
Here’s an article from 2020 where trump discusses pardoning himself.
https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/11/donald-trump-self-pardon
Here’s an article from 2018 where trump discusses pardoning himself.
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/amp/politics/trump-says-he-has-absolute-right-to-pardon-himself
This shit has been going on for ages. Biden should absolutely go fucking nuts.
Yeah, I get that much, but I’m not sure what the implication of the original comment is.
Like, are they implying Biden should call a hit on Trump? Should he just not cede the presidency? These are things the typical Lemmy user (as I’ve seen at least) would RAGE against under any other circumstances, so I’m inclined to assume thats not the case. But if not that, then what?