Uh… I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but you can though. Here’s a little example:
Africa is a shithole country. White people were kind to accept the slaves that Africans themselves provided, and civilized them. They even gave them sammiches sometimes!
There problem solved: now little Timmy doesn’t have to feel guilty about being the oppressor anymore! :-P Next week we’ll cover how chaining native Americans to (active) hot stoves in >100 degree temps in the desert will help teach them the true meaning of Christianity…
Believe it or not, but the “we gave them sandwiches sometimes” statement has also been put forth as an argument for why slavery was not so bad. FOR REAL!
Some have even been proposing - unironically mind you - that we return to using it!? (To be clear, I mean slavery, not offering anyone sandwiches. In fact, anyone offering free sandwiches should just be sent to jail. I am not making that up either, it’s a real thing somehow!?!? Despite what the Bible has to say about it, the “Bible-belt” states are making it illegal to offer food or water to the homeless😔)
Apparently they do not realize the truth that slavery has already been brought back -> there are more black people behind bars today than ever existed as slaves, and not always for “crimes” but sometimes trumped up charges in order to meet a quota, or minor offenses that a white person would be let off with a warning for (yes, many actual criminals too so hard to know the reality of the scope of the issues involved when so many falsehoods are mixed in along with the truths).
Thank you! It was https://youtu.be/hsxukOPEdgg?si=bHZrY9n2qSygpBPf, especially starting about 6-7 minutes in but really the whole episode talks about the topic of the OP. The sandwiches comment is at ~7:45. Enjoy!:-)
Maybe it wasn’t so terrible for some slaves - who were still slaves, by the way. I’ve read that some of them had good relationships with their “masters,” But - they were still not considered full human beings.
Slavery existed among African tribes for hundreds of years before white people started to get involved in it. In fact captured people from other tribes often became slaves to the winning tribes. I’m just saying that slavery isn’t just a white-person creation.
And modern slavery does take the form of black on black violence, petty crime and people selling drugs to each other (drug addiction itself is a kind of slavery). You wonder if we’ve made any progress at all as human beings in the last few centuries.
People have been evil since practically the dawn of mankind, but that seems no excuse to act that way ourselves? Also, many people from that continent may be shitty human beings (especially a hundred or so years ago, though also in modern times), yet I can think of a few shitty people from my own continent… past and present, and all of the other ones too? (in fact, several people that Donald Trump seems to be quoting from lately top the list)
Also, I never said that white people invented slavery - I only implied that slavery was bad, and tried to imply further that it doesn’t matter who started it, only that we chose to do it, and that in that decision, we were wrong. More importantly, since some people are unironically suggesting that we return to allowing slaves to exist, that we would be wrong if we were to start up the practice of slavery anew.
And no, your entire last paragraph I must vehemently deny: the likes of petty crime come NOWHERE CLOSE to the evils of slavery, ffs. Violence is likewise a form of evil, but the magnitude and the differing psychological impacts on the brain are nowhere close.
As for making progress, remember that time does nothing to change things, only effort does, e.g. the first law of thermodynamics: an object at rest will sit there for all of eternity, unless acted upon by a force strong enough to get it to shift. An analogy: imagine a car driving for 1,000 miles over the course of a very very long day’s drive… (I’ve done almost that actually - it’s exhausting!:-D) except now imagine that the car is up on cinder blocks, or like held up in a car lift in sth like a mechanic’s shop. You can run the engine at the same intensity for the same duration of time, point the car in the same direction, maybe use up a similar amount of gas, but until that rubber of the tire hits the asphalt of the road, that car is not going anywhere, not even 1 mile much less 1000.
The slaves were uprooted from their homeland(s, plural), brought to a new country with an entirely different ecosystem - different plants, different trees, different animals - and then further, children were ripped from their mothers’ arms ASAP, and often forbidden to be taught any knowledge whatsoever, except what their masters wanted them to know. They did not know how to hunt, fish, trap, or anything anymore - even if that knowledge would have transferred from Africa to the new place (somewhere in the Americas or whatever), it is not genetic and would have needed to have been taught, but largely b/c of concerns that the children be taught a particular subset of Christianity without being tainted by the old religions of their homeland, any kind of teaching of old knowledge was expressly forbidden. Those multi-generational slaves certainly did not know how to read, write, balance finances, perform maintenance/upkeep of a home or farm - except those activities that they used to perform as slaves, and even those were often so highly narrow & specialized as to be almost useless on their own - e.g. if you knew how to hammer nails into wood, then how would you learn where do you get the nails from in the first place? (or the hammer? and why/when would you even do it in the first place?). It is no wonder that starving people turned to crime, in order to eat! And yes, depression, and even drug use (though “drug addiction” is by no means in the sole purview of former slaves: one look at how many middle-class white people who have fallen prey to it in recent years is enough to show us that!).
Especially since slavery was only one, admittedly large, part of the overall problem. Driving while black, walking while black, running while black, buying while black, selling while black - it’s almost like doing ANYTHING while being black is enough to get someone killed! - and not just by a criminal, BY THE POLICE, WHO HAVE LEGALLY GOTTEN AWAY WITH IT, for centuries now!! (the number of black people who manage to shoot themselves in the back, then subsequently also in the head, is staggering…; and just so we do not gloss over that too quickly, keep in mind that it is medically, physically impossible for someone to shoot themselves in the back, and then also the head - i.e., it is 100% more likely that the policeman shot the person in the back, and then the head, but then the friendly coroner ruled it as a “suicide” for…reasons) The persecution of black people, often for no reason whatsoever but yes, sometimes b/c they did not act conciliatory enough (though again I direct your attention to sometimes it happening for no reason whatsoever, so even being 100% conciliatory, 100% of the time is insufficient to avoid incurring the wrath of an angry young white person who just felt like raping/killing/stealing from a former slave, AT ANY TIME), has continued ever since slavery ended.
What’s scary and sad is, we haven’t done anything to civilize them but we have done plenty to molest them with “christian” values such as bigotry and hate and religious nut jobbery. Africa is the cradle of all human civilization, and somehow we’ve devolved from there into tribal jerks and white nationalist scumbags.
God (who is white) forbid that little Timmy should ever be made to feel “uncomfortable” about the uncomfortable parts of human history. And why is it that today’s kid’s seem so molly-coddled and unconcerned about justice? Hmmm - it’s a real puzzlement all right. And after all real “christianity” is about how tightly you put those little brains into braces so they can’t be upset by reality.
I have heard that the younger generations are the opposite actually - b/c of having access to the internet and reading, they are being exposed at a younger age than ever before to things such as the fact that USA killed off the native Americans (genocidally murdering/raping/thieving/etc.), and also owned human beings. The parents ofc are freaking out, and trying to stop this “knowledge”, or at least they say that they want to slow, and not expose little Timmy to things that he doesn’t need to know about until he is older.
The odd part is that children are extremely resilient - they can accept death as natural, and the fact that this nation in its past has made some questionable (okay so fine: downright EVIL) choices - but it is the PARENTS that are the ones who cannot accept that.
The Baby Boomer generation in particular, I’ve noticed, seems to prefer this “let’s pretend” attitude, perhaps as a result of growing up emotionally scarred from all the wars (WWII, Korea, Vietnam), they just want to pretend that everything is fine, even as the world burns (in some cases, literally) around them.
I’m not saying I think kids have to have their faces shoved into the ugly side of things, but I think kids ARE more knowledgeable these days and have greater access to the horrible truths about human slavery and such. And I think they should know about it - because being aware is how you stop from repeating the mistakes of history.
I also agree about kids being extremely resilient. They can take a LOT of facts into their heads, like sponges, and not be destroyed by such knowledge. Of course parents don’t want to imagine their kids having to see or know about unpleasant stuff - but sometimes that’s the way to teach examples of how we, as humans, have failed each other.
For example (as a Boomer myself), in driver’s ed we had to watch gory accident movies filmed by the police, including things that would turn a hardcore horror fan’s stomach. Nobody enjoyed (I HOPE) watching those things, but you can bet they scared some of us silly enough to be cautionary drivers and be more careful behind the wheel.
No, the truth isn’t always beautiful, it can be harsh and disturbing. Yet not facing it always results in more bad outcomes.
Absolutely. Though as we were discussing elsewhere in this post, humans can be evil, and selfish, and greedy, and people can literally help bring back slavery rather than force themselves to truly look at it, call it out as “bad”, and do something about it.
I somewhat understand the other side of the argument as well - like, if someone was old and just wanted to lie back and enjoy life for awhile (as we all will be someday, unless we die first), then who am I to take action or even desire to stop such a one from doing exactly that? On the other hand, someone who ACTUALLY does that causes little to no harm, whereas someone who does the OPPOSITE of that, e.g. by taking the action to vote - whether at a local school board, or on the state or especially federal level - that is when such a person’s rights end, the very moment that they begin to infringe upon the rights of others.
And like, if a child were to take a book out of the library and burn it, wouldn’t that child get in trouble? Maybe they would have to pay a fine, perhaps have disciplinary action taken against them such as being suspended, or if mitigating circumstances coexist then at least be sent to counseling? So how much more in trouble should an adult get into, if they likewise burn a book, or maybe… oh… let’s say that they lead a violent attempt to overthrow the democratically-elected government, shitting on the constitution and in the process, cause at least one police officer to be killed, brutally, with his screams of agony caught on video - how much should such a person be punished? (That is a trick question obviously, b/c it presumes that “justice” is what is dispensed at all.) Let us call this “individual 1”, but moving past that, how much responsibility would a new person hold, let’s call them “individual 2” if even AFTER all of that occurred, and I mean it is not secret but rather came to light and was publicly condemned by people in positions of authority everywhere (Democrats, Republicans, Independents, in the Executive, Legislative - both House and Senate - Judicial, as in Supreme Court, DOJ, federal lower courts, etc.), this person (individual 2) actually votes for individual 1?
When we step up to become leaders, then we take on additional responsibility beyond the common man. Voting is similarly a position of responsibility, in determining what will be done in the USA. As people vote - again, whether in small, local matters such as school board issues, or even more so at the larger levels that affect so many more people besides one’s own self + family + even neighbors - I would hope that they would remember the lessons of history, so that we do not have to repeat them. However, since that turns out not to be true, it seems that slavery will be coming back… it is here already in fact, in many areas in the south where there are more incarcerated black people than there ever were as slaves, and I am not entirely convinced that everyone in there is fully a “criminal” (maybe, but the systems that push for convictions based on quotas, in those for-profit institutions, lends credence to the thought that not ALL of them are that way…); plus in any case employment seems to be becoming more slave-like all the time, as the “American dream” of potentially owning a home and thereby becoming financially independent is increasingly being taken away from so very many. We are already re-walking those paths, that so long ago we turned away from in disgust, but like a dog returning to its vomit… we cannot seem to help ourselves. Finally, I want to add that many people, e.g. in WWI and WWII both, literally gave their lives to fight against fascism spreading in other countries - however, fast-forward to today and a goodly fraction of people in America are indicating that they want to fight on the side for fascism, rather than against it. We are moving backwards, and not slowly either, but practically at a run:-( (though precisely how fast nobody seems to know, and I for one do not trust any media source anymore, nor do I see that changing anytime soon, which in itself should be an extremely troubling warning sign of things yet to come).
There is still slavery in the world, sad to say, so yes people can finds way to justify just about anything.
Well luckily I’m at the “lie back and enjoy life” stage of life myself - and it’s great! But it doesn’t mean I don’t do other things, like volunteer work or help with charity gambling nights and such here and there.
And I’m right with you on that punishment for someone who willfully attempts to overthrow America and all it stands for, shitting on the constitution and believing their rights are more important than those of anyone else. The killing of that police officer was unimaginably horrific - what won’t such people stop at? To me, it cries out for institutionalization of that person for the duration of their life, it’s just too dangerous to let such violent people roam around free.
It seems difficult to put such people in jail for such “crimes” when for one thing, >40% of Americans think that it was a good thing, and for another thing, several congresspeople have stated that they were there and participated - some even lying about that - as a badge of honor and pride. Truth has gotten “twisted” so that it is not “True” anymore, in some people’s minds. Brainwashing techniques - e.g. repeating something ad nauseam so as to bypass the logical thought processes and instill it as “simply a fact” (even/especially when it is no such thing) - are extremely powerful, and I see efforts to use it on both sides of the political divide.
Speaking of, at one point in our history we were Americans first, members of a political party second, but this is no longer true, and nowadays someone’s political affiliation is the single greatest defining characteristic of them (that btw is not true - or at least might not be!? - but it seems to be many people’s perception in any case:-D).
And therefore, in order to stop the badness that whatever the “other side” will do, yes even murder captured on television apparently can be excused, and even celebrated for just how “peaceful” that protest was, and b/c it was so “peaceful”, perhaps it should be done again, around… oh, let’s say… the time of the next election maybe?
That’s true, but I believe about 40 or 50% of the American population is totally insane and clinically dangerous to other people. They are likely to see any sort of insurrection and violence against our country as being a “good thing.”
I remember growing up in the 60s, a very divisive era, and how people were constantly bickering, the left was demonized, and the right was hated for their insistence on funding a non-winnable war and for hating the younger generation, it was quite a volatile time. I’ve not seen much of the “we’re American’s first” mentality, even after 911, but I always like to think it could still happen.
I watched the violent uprising on Jan 6th on television, and it would take an incredibly insane and unbalanced mentality to view it as being any sort of “peaceful” event. It most certainly wasn’t. And it wasn’t just a protest, it was a blatant attempt to destroy the country of America and everything we’ve built for the past two centuries.
And yeah, this coming political year will be the worst and most bloody in world history. What is going to happen this time around will change many people’s beliefs about who should be allowed to run around with guns in our country. It will be ugly, but it will be exactly what the world needs to see to begin a process of shutting violent people down at any cost.
Anyone who would make that claim unironically is indeed really fucking dumb. Plus it’s mean so they must be an absolute shithole person to even think that way in the first place.
It was a quote from trump - so, you know. Consider the source. He thinks Africa is a single country and people from there are pieces of shit. Of course, all non-white people are from shit hole countries, just ask him.
Elon Musk is African-American. Makes sense Trump is retarded enough to mistake his allies for enemies. Hopefully they both lose everything, fuck billionaires.
In a way all of us are ultimately of African descent. If what history and geology teach us are true. Frankly I think it’s great and I enjoy that idea, that all of us come from common ancestors on the Savannah.
I know it sounds nutty and delusional to say the moon landing was fake (and perhaps you’re being facetious) but - I remember watching it back in 1969 and it seemed kinda fake on TV back then. I’m not saying one way or the other, but it seems awfully suspicious that we suddenly made it to the moon in time to beat the Russians back then, yet we don’t really know today how to engineer a spacecraft to make a return flight from the moon (the hard part isn’t getting there, it’s getting back again). SOMETHING seems fishy about it all. Just sayin’!
Just to interject here. For those wondering the actual thing holding up the lander and liftoff lunar vehicle is a really sore spot. Because what’s stopping us isn’t some technical challenge.
SpaceX owned by Elon Musk and Blue Origin owned by Jeff Bezos are having a spat over who gets to build the HLS. And the objecting and complaining to courts that NASA isn’t being fair to (insert either of these players) has easily set back going back to the moon at least half a decade if not moreso.
So this pretty specific part of the whole moon landing has actually held up a lot surprisingly but mostly because we’ve got two very rich people having a very visible cat fight that’s slowing everything else related to moon travel down to a crawl.
But according to Nasa channel’s own programs, the challenge of getting to the moon is not the challenge of getting there, it’s how to get back again. Which puzzles me, since the claim is we easily did it in 1969 (though the return part of the trip was very much not talked about). I’m not claiming the moon landing didn’t happen, I sure want to believe it did. I just find it weird that this could be true.
And I’m very much a cheerleader for getting us back there and beyond. I want my little yellow starship vest with crew insignia on it.
I know they spent years planning it and testing it all, so I’m not saying it wasn’t possible. I just thought it was a little too “smooth” and predictable, the way it all went without much of a hitch. But - I’m hoping that will be how it goes the next time we make a landing there.
In the 1960s we built a moon rocket. Single purpose built for going to the moon and back.
Today, companies are trying to build general purpose ultra heavy lift rockets and slapping a moon mission on them. Starship? Not a moon rocket. New Glenn? Not a moon rocket.
Its like living in an RV and saying “living in it isnt the problem, its the plumbing!” Plumbing is an easy solved problem for fixed houses. You’ve only made the situation harder on yourself by trying to be dual purpose
Hmm good point. I think with today’s technology there CAN be more they can do in terms of making it multi-purpose, and hopefully they can work out all the kinks. I would love see us back on the moon in the next decade or so.
We did it using analoge technology that is no longer produced and with security standards much lower than is acceptable today. The tech that we are “missing” is modern tech used for the same purposes with acceptable reliability and security. One hurdle with digital over analog is that radiation affects it a lot more. Not insurmountable, but requires work to prove it lives up to modern standards.
Sure there are technical challenges in getting to the Moon, landing, relaunching, and returning to Earth, but none of them are particularly insurmountable. The reason we haven’t really been back to the Moon is that public and political interest in space practically disappeared and funding along with it. And now space agencies have to either wait for some petty billionaire twats to stop cat-fighting or somehow scrape together enough of a budget out of countless other, arguably more important missions.
Also, just because something seemed fake on tv, it does NOT indicate that it is actually fake. Moon-landing hoax conspiracies have been torn apart numerous times and are all over YouTube, buried under all the hoax videos. We also have physical evidence such as Moon rocks that we use for research and reflectors placed on the Moon that we can shoot lasers at. You can even visit the Saturn V in a museum (can’t remember which one off the top of my head). The real question is why fake the Moon landing? Why spend billions of dollars on R/D, hardware, and technology as well as employ thousands of people for decades just to not do the thing? Occam’s razor is particularly relevant here, the simplest explanation is almost certainly the correct one.
We know how it’s just no one’s doing it. The honest program is working up to that but it’s going to be a while, if you wanted to go faster bug your Congressman about NASA funding versus military funding
Well by golly - someone SHOULD be doing it! (Pounds fist on table). I want my moon cheese and moon rock jewelry! Believe I do hound my congressmen about funding NASA - I’m very much a pro-space space cadet.
Moon landing was fake though, you can’t teach something that is fake. /s
That’s probably what they’ll teach. That it was a fake liberal lie to undermine the glorious nation of Russia.
Uh… I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but you can though. Here’s a little example:
There problem solved: now little Timmy doesn’t have to feel guilty about being the oppressor anymore! :-P Next week we’ll cover how chaining native Americans to (active) hot stoves in >100 degree temps in the desert will help teach them the true meaning of Christianity…
The scary thing is that I’ve heard the “we civilized the Africans” claim made seriously before.
Believe it or not, but the “we gave them sandwiches sometimes” statement has also been put forth as an argument for why slavery was not so bad. FOR REAL!
Some have even been proposing - unironically mind you - that we return to using it!? (To be clear, I mean slavery, not offering anyone sandwiches. In fact, anyone offering free sandwiches should just be sent to jail. I am not making that up either, it’s a real thing somehow!?!? Despite what the Bible has to say about it, the “Bible-belt” states are making it illegal to offer food or water to the homeless😔)
Apparently they do not realize the truth that slavery has already been brought back -> there are more black people behind bars today than ever existed as slaves, and not always for “crimes” but sometimes trumped up charges in order to meet a quota, or minor offenses that a white person would be let off with a warning for (yes, many actual criminals too so hard to know the reality of the scope of the issues involved when so many falsehoods are mixed in along with the truths).
I think you missed to attach a link somewhere?
Thank you! It was https://youtu.be/hsxukOPEdgg?si=bHZrY9n2qSygpBPf, especially starting about 6-7 minutes in but really the whole episode talks about the topic of the OP. The sandwiches comment is at ~7:45. Enjoy!:-)
Maybe it wasn’t so terrible for some slaves - who were still slaves, by the way. I’ve read that some of them had good relationships with their “masters,” But - they were still not considered full human beings.
Slavery existed among African tribes for hundreds of years before white people started to get involved in it. In fact captured people from other tribes often became slaves to the winning tribes. I’m just saying that slavery isn’t just a white-person creation.
And modern slavery does take the form of black on black violence, petty crime and people selling drugs to each other (drug addiction itself is a kind of slavery). You wonder if we’ve made any progress at all as human beings in the last few centuries.
People have been evil since practically the dawn of mankind, but that seems no excuse to act that way ourselves? Also, many people from that continent may be shitty human beings (especially a hundred or so years ago, though also in modern times), yet I can think of a few shitty people from my own continent… past and present, and all of the other ones too? (in fact, several people that Donald Trump seems to be quoting from lately top the list)
Also, I never said that white people invented slavery - I only implied that slavery was bad, and tried to imply further that it doesn’t matter who started it, only that we chose to do it, and that in that decision, we were wrong. More importantly, since some people are unironically suggesting that we return to allowing slaves to exist, that we would be wrong if we were to start up the practice of slavery anew.
And no, your entire last paragraph I must vehemently deny: the likes of petty crime come NOWHERE CLOSE to the evils of slavery, ffs. Violence is likewise a form of evil, but the magnitude and the differing psychological impacts on the brain are nowhere close.
As for making progress, remember that time does nothing to change things, only effort does, e.g. the first law of thermodynamics: an object at rest will sit there for all of eternity, unless acted upon by a force strong enough to get it to shift. An analogy: imagine a car driving for 1,000 miles over the course of a very very long day’s drive… (I’ve done almost that actually - it’s exhausting!:-D) except now imagine that the car is up on cinder blocks, or like held up in a car lift in sth like a mechanic’s shop. You can run the engine at the same intensity for the same duration of time, point the car in the same direction, maybe use up a similar amount of gas, but until that rubber of the tire hits the asphalt of the road, that car is not going anywhere, not even 1 mile much less 1000.
The slaves were uprooted from their homeland(s, plural), brought to a new country with an entirely different ecosystem - different plants, different trees, different animals - and then further, children were ripped from their mothers’ arms ASAP, and often forbidden to be taught any knowledge whatsoever, except what their masters wanted them to know. They did not know how to hunt, fish, trap, or anything anymore - even if that knowledge would have transferred from Africa to the new place (somewhere in the Americas or whatever), it is not genetic and would have needed to have been taught, but largely b/c of concerns that the children be taught a particular subset of Christianity without being tainted by the old religions of their homeland, any kind of teaching of old knowledge was expressly forbidden. Those multi-generational slaves certainly did not know how to read, write, balance finances, perform maintenance/upkeep of a home or farm - except those activities that they used to perform as slaves, and even those were often so highly narrow & specialized as to be almost useless on their own - e.g. if you knew how to hammer nails into wood, then how would you learn where do you get the nails from in the first place? (or the hammer? and why/when would you even do it in the first place?). It is no wonder that starving people turned to crime, in order to eat! And yes, depression, and even drug use (though “drug addiction” is by no means in the sole purview of former slaves: one look at how many middle-class white people who have fallen prey to it in recent years is enough to show us that!).
Especially since slavery was only one, admittedly large, part of the overall problem. Driving while black, walking while black, running while black, buying while black, selling while black - it’s almost like doing ANYTHING while being black is enough to get someone killed! - and not just by a criminal, BY THE POLICE, WHO HAVE LEGALLY GOTTEN AWAY WITH IT, for centuries now!! (the number of black people who manage to shoot themselves in the back, then subsequently also in the head, is staggering…; and just so we do not gloss over that too quickly, keep in mind that it is medically, physically impossible for someone to shoot themselves in the back, and then also the head - i.e., it is 100% more likely that the policeman shot the person in the back, and then the head, but then the friendly coroner ruled it as a “suicide” for…reasons) The persecution of black people, often for no reason whatsoever but yes, sometimes b/c they did not act conciliatory enough (though again I direct your attention to sometimes it happening for no reason whatsoever, so even being 100% conciliatory, 100% of the time is insufficient to avoid incurring the wrath of an angry young white person who just felt like raping/killing/stealing from a former slave, AT ANY TIME), has continued ever since slavery ended.
But I have hit the word limit. :-|
What’s scary and sad is, we haven’t done anything to civilize them but we have done plenty to molest them with “christian” values such as bigotry and hate and religious nut jobbery. Africa is the cradle of all human civilization, and somehow we’ve devolved from there into tribal jerks and white nationalist scumbags.
God (who is white) forbid that little Timmy should ever be made to feel “uncomfortable” about the uncomfortable parts of human history. And why is it that today’s kid’s seem so molly-coddled and unconcerned about justice? Hmmm - it’s a real puzzlement all right. And after all real “christianity” is about how tightly you put those little brains into braces so they can’t be upset by reality.
I have heard that the younger generations are the opposite actually - b/c of having access to the internet and reading, they are being exposed at a younger age than ever before to things such as the fact that USA killed off the native Americans (genocidally murdering/raping/thieving/etc.), and also owned human beings. The parents ofc are freaking out, and trying to stop this “knowledge”, or at least they say that they want to slow, and not expose little Timmy to things that he doesn’t need to know about until he is older.
The odd part is that children are extremely resilient - they can accept death as natural, and the fact that this nation in its past has made some questionable (okay so fine: downright EVIL) choices - but it is the PARENTS that are the ones who cannot accept that.
The Baby Boomer generation in particular, I’ve noticed, seems to prefer this “let’s pretend” attitude, perhaps as a result of growing up emotionally scarred from all the wars (WWII, Korea, Vietnam), they just want to pretend that everything is fine, even as the world burns (in some cases, literally) around them.
I’m not saying I think kids have to have their faces shoved into the ugly side of things, but I think kids ARE more knowledgeable these days and have greater access to the horrible truths about human slavery and such. And I think they should know about it - because being aware is how you stop from repeating the mistakes of history.
I also agree about kids being extremely resilient. They can take a LOT of facts into their heads, like sponges, and not be destroyed by such knowledge. Of course parents don’t want to imagine their kids having to see or know about unpleasant stuff - but sometimes that’s the way to teach examples of how we, as humans, have failed each other.
For example (as a Boomer myself), in driver’s ed we had to watch gory accident movies filmed by the police, including things that would turn a hardcore horror fan’s stomach. Nobody enjoyed (I HOPE) watching those things, but you can bet they scared some of us silly enough to be cautionary drivers and be more careful behind the wheel.
No, the truth isn’t always beautiful, it can be harsh and disturbing. Yet not facing it always results in more bad outcomes.
Absolutely. Though as we were discussing elsewhere in this post, humans can be evil, and selfish, and greedy, and people can literally help bring back slavery rather than force themselves to truly look at it, call it out as “bad”, and do something about it.
I somewhat understand the other side of the argument as well - like, if someone was old and just wanted to lie back and enjoy life for awhile (as we all will be someday, unless we die first), then who am I to take action or even desire to stop such a one from doing exactly that? On the other hand, someone who ACTUALLY does that causes little to no harm, whereas someone who does the OPPOSITE of that, e.g. by taking the action to vote - whether at a local school board, or on the state or especially federal level - that is when such a person’s rights end, the very moment that they begin to infringe upon the rights of others.
And like, if a child were to take a book out of the library and burn it, wouldn’t that child get in trouble? Maybe they would have to pay a fine, perhaps have disciplinary action taken against them such as being suspended, or if mitigating circumstances coexist then at least be sent to counseling? So how much more in trouble should an adult get into, if they likewise burn a book, or maybe… oh… let’s say that they lead a violent attempt to overthrow the democratically-elected government, shitting on the constitution and in the process, cause at least one police officer to be killed, brutally, with his screams of agony caught on video - how much should such a person be punished? (That is a trick question obviously, b/c it presumes that “justice” is what is dispensed at all.) Let us call this “individual 1”, but moving past that, how much responsibility would a new person hold, let’s call them “individual 2” if even AFTER all of that occurred, and I mean it is not secret but rather came to light and was publicly condemned by people in positions of authority everywhere (Democrats, Republicans, Independents, in the Executive, Legislative - both House and Senate - Judicial, as in Supreme Court, DOJ, federal lower courts, etc.), this person (individual 2) actually votes for individual 1?
When we step up to become leaders, then we take on additional responsibility beyond the common man. Voting is similarly a position of responsibility, in determining what will be done in the USA. As people vote - again, whether in small, local matters such as school board issues, or even more so at the larger levels that affect so many more people besides one’s own self + family + even neighbors - I would hope that they would remember the lessons of history, so that we do not have to repeat them. However, since that turns out not to be true, it seems that slavery will be coming back… it is here already in fact, in many areas in the south where there are more incarcerated black people than there ever were as slaves, and I am not entirely convinced that everyone in there is fully a “criminal” (maybe, but the systems that push for convictions based on quotas, in those for-profit institutions, lends credence to the thought that not ALL of them are that way…); plus in any case employment seems to be becoming more slave-like all the time, as the “American dream” of potentially owning a home and thereby becoming financially independent is increasingly being taken away from so very many. We are already re-walking those paths, that so long ago we turned away from in disgust, but like a dog returning to its vomit… we cannot seem to help ourselves. Finally, I want to add that many people, e.g. in WWI and WWII both, literally gave their lives to fight against fascism spreading in other countries - however, fast-forward to today and a goodly fraction of people in America are indicating that they want to fight on the side for fascism, rather than against it. We are moving backwards, and not slowly either, but practically at a run:-( (though precisely how fast nobody seems to know, and I for one do not trust any media source anymore, nor do I see that changing anytime soon, which in itself should be an extremely troubling warning sign of things yet to come).
There is still slavery in the world, sad to say, so yes people can finds way to justify just about anything.
Well luckily I’m at the “lie back and enjoy life” stage of life myself - and it’s great! But it doesn’t mean I don’t do other things, like volunteer work or help with charity gambling nights and such here and there.
And I’m right with you on that punishment for someone who willfully attempts to overthrow America and all it stands for, shitting on the constitution and believing their rights are more important than those of anyone else. The killing of that police officer was unimaginably horrific - what won’t such people stop at? To me, it cries out for institutionalization of that person for the duration of their life, it’s just too dangerous to let such violent people roam around free.
It seems difficult to put such people in jail for such “crimes” when for one thing, >40% of Americans think that it was a good thing, and for another thing, several congresspeople have stated that they were there and participated - some even lying about that - as a badge of honor and pride. Truth has gotten “twisted” so that it is not “True” anymore, in some people’s minds. Brainwashing techniques - e.g. repeating something ad nauseam so as to bypass the logical thought processes and instill it as “simply a fact” (even/especially when it is no such thing) - are extremely powerful, and I see efforts to use it on both sides of the political divide.
Speaking of, at one point in our history we were Americans first, members of a political party second, but this is no longer true, and nowadays someone’s political affiliation is the single greatest defining characteristic of them (that btw is not true - or at least might not be!? - but it seems to be many people’s perception in any case:-D).
And therefore, in order to stop the badness that whatever the “other side” will do, yes even murder captured on television apparently can be excused, and even celebrated for just how “peaceful” that protest was, and b/c it was so “peaceful”, perhaps it should be done again, around… oh, let’s say… the time of the next election maybe?
I guess we will see what happens.
That’s true, but I believe about 40 or 50% of the American population is totally insane and clinically dangerous to other people. They are likely to see any sort of insurrection and violence against our country as being a “good thing.”
I remember growing up in the 60s, a very divisive era, and how people were constantly bickering, the left was demonized, and the right was hated for their insistence on funding a non-winnable war and for hating the younger generation, it was quite a volatile time. I’ve not seen much of the “we’re American’s first” mentality, even after 911, but I always like to think it could still happen.
I watched the violent uprising on Jan 6th on television, and it would take an incredibly insane and unbalanced mentality to view it as being any sort of “peaceful” event. It most certainly wasn’t. And it wasn’t just a protest, it was a blatant attempt to destroy the country of America and everything we’ve built for the past two centuries.
And yeah, this coming political year will be the worst and most bloody in world history. What is going to happen this time around will change many people’s beliefs about who should be allowed to run around with guns in our country. It will be ugly, but it will be exactly what the world needs to see to begin a process of shutting violent people down at any cost.
Africa is a continent. You can fit all of Europe as well as the entire United States inside of it. What you quoted is really fucking dumb.
Ah good, so you understood the joke.
It wasn’t meant to be intelligent.
No shit Sherlock
Anyone who would make that claim unironically is indeed really fucking dumb. Plus it’s mean so they must be an absolute shithole person to even think that way in the first place.
It was a quote from trump - so, you know. Consider the source. He thinks Africa is a single country and people from there are pieces of shit. Of course, all non-white people are from shit hole countries, just ask him.
Elon Musk is African-American. Makes sense Trump is retarded enough to mistake his allies for enemies. Hopefully they both lose everything, fuck billionaires.
In a way all of us are ultimately of African descent. If what history and geology teach us are true. Frankly I think it’s great and I enjoy that idea, that all of us come from common ancestors on the Savannah.
Two wrongs doesn’t make a right
I know it sounds nutty and delusional to say the moon landing was fake (and perhaps you’re being facetious) but - I remember watching it back in 1969 and it seemed kinda fake on TV back then. I’m not saying one way or the other, but it seems awfully suspicious that we suddenly made it to the moon in time to beat the Russians back then, yet we don’t really know today how to engineer a spacecraft to make a return flight from the moon (the hard part isn’t getting there, it’s getting back again). SOMETHING seems fishy about it all. Just sayin’!
Just to interject here. For those wondering the actual thing holding up the lander and liftoff lunar vehicle is a really sore spot. Because what’s stopping us isn’t some technical challenge.
SpaceX owned by Elon Musk and Blue Origin owned by Jeff Bezos are having a spat over who gets to build the HLS. And the objecting and complaining to courts that NASA isn’t being fair to (insert either of these players) has easily set back going back to the moon at least half a decade if not moreso.
So this pretty specific part of the whole moon landing has actually held up a lot surprisingly but mostly because we’ve got two very rich people having a very visible cat fight that’s slowing everything else related to moon travel down to a crawl.
But according to Nasa channel’s own programs, the challenge of getting to the moon is not the challenge of getting there, it’s how to get back again. Which puzzles me, since the claim is we easily did it in 1969 (though the return part of the trip was very much not talked about). I’m not claiming the moon landing didn’t happen, I sure want to believe it did. I just find it weird that this could be true.
And I’m very much a cheerleader for getting us back there and beyond. I want my little yellow starship vest with crew insignia on it.
Who was claiming that “easily” was how we did it?
Lamo it was not easy. It was rigorously planned and quadruple checked. Many lab tests and smaller satilite launch to test rockets.
I know they spent years planning it and testing it all, so I’m not saying it wasn’t possible. I just thought it was a little too “smooth” and predictable, the way it all went without much of a hitch. But - I’m hoping that will be how it goes the next time we make a landing there.
In the 1960s we built a moon rocket. Single purpose built for going to the moon and back.
Today, companies are trying to build general purpose ultra heavy lift rockets and slapping a moon mission on them. Starship? Not a moon rocket. New Glenn? Not a moon rocket.
Its like living in an RV and saying “living in it isnt the problem, its the plumbing!” Plumbing is an easy solved problem for fixed houses. You’ve only made the situation harder on yourself by trying to be dual purpose
Hmm good point. I think with today’s technology there CAN be more they can do in terms of making it multi-purpose, and hopefully they can work out all the kinks. I would love see us back on the moon in the next decade or so.
We did it using analoge technology that is no longer produced and with security standards much lower than is acceptable today. The tech that we are “missing” is modern tech used for the same purposes with acceptable reliability and security. One hurdle with digital over analog is that radiation affects it a lot more. Not insurmountable, but requires work to prove it lives up to modern standards.
Sure there are technical challenges in getting to the Moon, landing, relaunching, and returning to Earth, but none of them are particularly insurmountable. The reason we haven’t really been back to the Moon is that public and political interest in space practically disappeared and funding along with it. And now space agencies have to either wait for some petty billionaire twats to stop cat-fighting or somehow scrape together enough of a budget out of countless other, arguably more important missions.
Also, just because something seemed fake on tv, it does NOT indicate that it is actually fake. Moon-landing hoax conspiracies have been torn apart numerous times and are all over YouTube, buried under all the hoax videos. We also have physical evidence such as Moon rocks that we use for research and reflectors placed on the Moon that we can shoot lasers at. You can even visit the Saturn V in a museum (can’t remember which one off the top of my head). The real question is why fake the Moon landing? Why spend billions of dollars on R/D, hardware, and technology as well as employ thousands of people for decades just to not do the thing? Occam’s razor is particularly relevant here, the simplest explanation is almost certainly the correct one.
We know how it’s just no one’s doing it. The honest program is working up to that but it’s going to be a while, if you wanted to go faster bug your Congressman about NASA funding versus military funding
Well by golly - someone SHOULD be doing it! (Pounds fist on table). I want my moon cheese and moon rock jewelry! Believe I do hound my congressmen about funding NASA - I’m very much a pro-space space cadet.