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E: Let’s all talk about what bikes should or shoudn’t cost
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I refuse to believe hobbyists are spending $10K on bikes, or commuters are spending $1K.
I can barely accept that the going rate for used bikes is over $200.
I couldn’t believe it either, so I went to the Trek.com site.
I hate this decade.
Trek is really expensive. Go to Decathlon or equivalent.
Dooood! I went to the site and the first bike I see is almost $11,000.00!!
I understand that one maker might be less costly, but I’m old enough to remember when you could get a good used bike for one day’s labor.
Wow, the US website really pushes for the high-end bikes! In France they highlight the low-mid range (between 300 and 800€).
A 300 Euro bike is about $350.00 US. That’s about what I’d expect to pay for a bike these days.
Frankly, it depends how much you use your bike. I commute these days with a used 150€ bike, for which I invested 100€ in upgrades. But that’s because my commute is short (5km) and because it sleeps every day in the street next to a big train station. In the past I was commuting 2*10km daily and I had a 1000€ gravel bike that never stayed overnight in the street. It was definitely much more comfortable.
I would say a 300€ is fine for daily commute under 5km, but closer to 800-1000€ is probably a good idea for 10km and above.
Thanks for the advice.
1k for a new high quality bike has been normal for 10-15 years. Anything beyond that has hugely diminishing returns.
If you want everything for a full shimano 105 set, that alone will cost you like 600$ or more. Then you still need a frame and wheels and saddle etc
Buying used is really the best play with bikes.
I don’t think I ever had that much disposable income to spend on a bike at the same time as living where I could commute to work on a bike.
If you want an electric bike, the price goes up fast.
If you want one with a belt so that it won’t take crazy maintenance not to degrade over the winter, it goes up faster still.
If you want storage for your purse and whatnot, a bit more expensive still. A good large basket is more expensive than you’d think.
I can easily believe a commuter ebike hits a grand.
I just never assume anything with a motor when I encounter the word “bicycle”.
Where I live, 1k gets you a decent commuter bike without a motor. Doesn’t even matter much if used or new. Then you spend ~200 on parts every year. It’s outside 24/7, I don’t have a garage.
Oh yeah it took me years to finally find an apartment where the landlord would allow me to get a storage shed. I’m glad I can finally own a bike.
Leaving the bike outside all the time was always taught to me as a no-no that’ll pretty much instantly ruin your bike, so I hadn’t considered it.
Now though I’m moving this year or next year and I’m unsure how we’ll manage with my shed. Can it be moved? Will someone buy it? 🤔 Eh, I guess I’ll see.
I don’t have a garage either, but I want to get a shed so I can stop spending $200/yr in repairs.
Anything but carrying the bike up from the basement every morning
Oh god that would stop me from using my bike so fast.
A-men
Fr, when I hear bike my default thought is always like a $200 Huffy, not these pro-sumer things that cost nearly as much as a damn car
Fair. I just don’t consider non-electric one in such a hilly city. I just know I’d be too lazy to face the hills without the help of a motor.
As someone who repairs bikes for a hobby this all sounds insane. I paid like $10 for my back rack with folding baskets
I mean i got a metal-mesh basket for the back for 20€ and its longer than wide so i can still park my bike in tight spaces. Idk what you mean by “good large basket” but mine is good and large enough
Over here the only one I could find that would allow me to lug around my purse and a little bit of extra cargo if needed was this one. It doesn’t even mount on my bike so the people at the bike shop had to improvise with zip ties and the like.
It took a while to find, because I couldn’t trust steel not to start getting rust stains on all my stuff, and my previous one pretty much instantly broke the very first time my bike fell, so I couldn’t trust just any kind of plastic.
I had the employees of no less than 5 bike shops try to recommend me something with little success before finally finding something. Most shops seem to carry 0~1 models of bike basket period, and not to have much more that they can order from their distributors.
I think North American shops are just confused at the idea of a bike for anything but leisure overall. Which is understandable considering how goddamn dangerous our awful car-centric cities can be.
I love my big basket, but man was it not easy to find
My first thought on that second link was: Id never buy such a thing made of plastic?!
In Switzerland you can get normal Baskets for CHF 15.- to 100.- (around 1:1 to USD). https://www.veloplus.ch/shop/ausruestung/koerbe/gepaecktraegerkoerbe You see them all the time, they are so common that the images often don’t even feature a size comparison or use demonstration like in your first link, because everyone knows them 😅.
10-20 years ago it was considered a woman or gay thing to have them but apparently they are convenient enough to have overcome that stigma.
The one you got is a bit heftier and looks pretty heavy tbh
Oh yeah they look pretty handy, and affordable. Only thing I’d be worried about is that they look like steel. I don’t know how well they react to water, snow and salt.
But you definitely look like you have a lot more options than we do.
The plastic basket was the best the bike shop where I bought mine could find. Most people here use satchels on the sides of the wheel, but 1. That precludes the use of a trailer for groceries, 2. I don’t see what’s so convenient about them unless you’re a camper.
There’s also just having no storage and using a backpack for everything. A popular option, but backpacks are hot. Not a fan.
The basket I ended up with is certainly big, but its aluminium construction reduces the weight, and above all, it’s handled a few falls just fine so far.
And well, on an e-bike, weight is much less critical. I paid a fortune for this bike; might as well enjoy the perks.
Free + a $30 tuneup here.
Hey, those belong to people!
This one actually was being given away.
The bikes I am looking to buy for the purpose of commuting over mixed terrain is in the $800-$1,400 price range (as of last year before tariff stuff). I don’t currently own a bike but I have owned and ridden a number of bikes in the past. The couple of hundred dollar bikes from like Walmart are just trash that don’t hold up. They fall apart pretty quickly under heavy riding.
All of this assumes one is buying new. If we are talking used then all of the above is somewhat a moot point.
Even within new the kind of riding matters a lot. If I know for a fact that I would only ever be riding on smooth paved roads then an old fixed frame street bike with skinny tires and very basic brakes and gears would make a lot of sense. There is zero chance that bike is going to be switching between road, grass, gravel, mud, and some of the other terrain I would be commuting across though.
You could get a used budget bike for that much like
Even a couple decades ago they started at hundreds of dollars new, unless you’re talking about poorly assembled bike shaped objects made from sketchy parts.
Also, there are single bikes that cost well over 10 grand. Rich enthusiasts may have entire garages full of high end bikes that cost more than your average car.
It wasn’t the cheapest bike but nothing special. I’ve had it for 10 years and I’m super happy with it.
Even lower-midrange level road bikes are now at least $1k. Its a ridiculous market.
I commute to work every day, and I don’t own a car. My bike (Shimano gear-hub with a belt drive) was about 1k€, and it was one of the cheaper models available.
I also don’t own a car and commute every day. I hear people talk about how Chicago has a low cost-of-living and I guess this is what they mean.
I think you’re both idiots wasting money when you can get a perfectly good bike for like $200?
If you are doing any serious distance and/or are older there is a noticeable difference in comfort and efficiency over $1k. I rode shitty bikes my entire life. When I hopped on a $1500 bike I couldn’t believe how much faster I could go and how comfortable it was. The transfer of energy into forward motion was wild. That being said I bought my bike for $100 off of Craigslist 10 years ago.
Both camps are right!
Cheap bikes just don’t ride nowhere as nicely nor do they last as expensive bikes do.
BUT! The worst thing about owning an expensive bike is owning an expensive bike.
It’s a thief magnet and source of envy of other riders.
You really need to find a sweet spot between a quality bike and being able to leave it locked in the city without having pangs of anxiety of it being stolen.
Bike recycling is probably the answer. Cheaper, worse looking, but you can often find high quality parts and frames and repair it yourself
10k? 1k? What??? 😂
When I arrived in that country, I bought a 2nd hand bike, for daily commute. I overpaid. A lot.
That bike cost me 300 😅
I think a bike should cost $100
Mine cost like $200
Fixed speed, it’s ok i guess
You don’t ever have to wonder if someone
is veganrides a fixie…What is the advantage of fixed speed over variable?
Not much at all, in general they are harder to ride. Especially in hilly places.
There are less gears so that aspect is maybe easier to fix. Slightly lighter due to less gears, but it is only slightly. Maybe other things?It’s a bit like iPhones of old, crossfit, and veganism. You won’t ask about them but the people who use them will tell you about it anyways.
How do you know someone isn’t vegan?
Don’t worry, they’ll tell you.
Theyre a lot of fun to ride if you’re not going ip and down alot. The pedals are fixed to the gear so it keeps ‘pushing’ your feet around if you try to stop pedaling without enough resistance, which takes some getting used to, but in general it feels like you have alot more control of the movement of the bike, especially at lower speeds, and since each pedal is always a constant amount of movement forward, it can lead to a very fine feeling of movement and control. Any of those bike dancing videos are done with fixies, as are bike polo games usually. And yeah, theyre significantly easier to maintain and fix.
That bike football sport is very entertaining. They must use fixies. I could watch that all day.
It’s perfect if you hate yourself.
I think of it more like vinyl. It doesn’t actually sound better, but it’s fun.
Bike moves in concert with you— legs go forward, bike goes forward. Legs go back, bike goes back. Simplifies everything, it feels more like an extension of yourself.
Yo! Fellow $200 fixie enjoyer?! Where’s the fixed gear lemmy community?
I knew I’d be a summer casual rider so bought a 2nd hand road bike for €300 18yrs back.
Still have it, can’t justify getting a new one as it just… works
I actually think throwing a lot of money into a bike isn’t a bad idea. They easily last a life time; and if having a really nice bike incentives one to use it more; it’s totally worth it. Whatever it takes to keep you out of a car is good in my eyes
The only problem preventing it lasting a life time is that they easily get stolen.
This is more a problem of where you live.
Damn. I have been spending so much effort trying to convince myself NOT to buy a new bike. Then this guy comes along.
As someone that has a $11k bike I can clarify some things.
I have a Wilier Granturismo SLR. About ~90% of the components are carbon fiber. Carbon Fiber, especially high end carbon fiber isn’t cheap. Besides the bike; my wheels, pedals, parts of the cranks, handlebars, saddle, saddle post, and probably some other things are carbon fiber.
I always hear people talk about getting carbon fiber components for cheaper because you have a shit tin of Chinese companies come in and steal these bike companies IP and make shit frames. Look at Chinorellos, shit ton of Chinese companies steal frame designs and re-make them with shit metal and the bike falls apart after a year.
Another thing…why does any give a fuck how much my bike costs? My dad is an audiophile guy and my bike costs as much as 1 (not a pair) of his speakers, and he has a mid-range system. Cycling is something that I love, I ride almost everyday and will spend hours and hours on the bike. I’d gladly pay less than $11k on my next bike but when you get into the higher end market you’re going to pay more, that’s true across almost ALL sports or hobby activities
Yeah, it’s just a silly meme. I would spend a lot of money on a bike if it was my hobby. But here I am getting shamed for spending as much as 1k for a bike, which I thought was the bare minimum for a daily driver.
Sorry I didnt mean to come off as abrasive towards you. If someone is giving you shit about the cost of you’re bike then tell them to fuck off. I’ve been cycling and competing for 7 years now, and cycling culture is about the ride, not the bike the rider is on. Some bikes cost $15k, others $1k, and all these expensive components can help you get faster, but at the end of the day, what really makes you faster isn’t the bike, it’s the rider.
Yeah no worries! Just a bit of bike drama ITT
All good boss. If you don’t mind, what bike are you riding?
Sure! I have a VSF T-500 steel frame 21 speed with disk breaks
$1k for this bike is a steal lol. These are hand made in Germany and look 99% better than most commuters I see. The steel is real king! Keep riding
Yes my previous bike (also steel VSF) got stolen, so I was looking for the exact same one. Made sense to buy it new (with new parts) and I got a good deal on it.
Some bikes cost $15k, others $1k
This really makes me want to show up to a cycling event with a $200 Huffy
Hey man, show up to the group ride with whatever you want, just keep up with the pace
You and your dad have extravagant hobbies and live in a world most people cannot relate to. The vast majority of people on earth will never enjoy spending so much money and free time on their hobbies.
We’re not millionaires or make a significant amount of money. I saved money aside for my bike and my dad did the same for his stereo system. If you want to look at hobbies that cost a lot of money, looking at boating. People spend hundreds of thousands of dollars for boats and nobody blinks an eye. The cost of my bike wouldn’t cover the yearly maintenance for a boat
Sorry, that came off more critical than I meant it to be. There’s nothing wrong with enjoying a hobby, and certainly there are many frivolous things wealthy people do that cost far more money than you and I will make in our combined lifetimes. Everyone exists within an economic strata, and perspective hard to come by without personal experience.
Saying that any hobby might cost thousands of dollars, or tens of thousands of dollars, is as absurd to someone living in poverty as thinking a banana might cost $10.
Look I get it, I love cycling and own a few nice bikes ($1-4k) but let’s not pretend that the value is there at $11k. Outside of world tour riders, there’s no way you’re actually faster or more comfortable at $11k than about $5k. You already get carbon frame/wheels and near top of the line components for $5k-ish. So to OPs question, to me that’s the upper limit for what fancy bikes should cost for actual normal humans. Realistically 2k for road/gravel, maybe 3k for MTB is jusy barely slower and almost imperceptively less nice than 5k bikes. “High end” is only meaningful if there are actual tangible benefits that come along with the price tag. I support anyone out there on bikes, i just think $11k is a bit silly in a world with this much wealth inequality. I’m sure some folks think the exact same thing about me and my bikes tbf. Have fun and be safe out there.
So, I’ve also ridden a wide range of bikes and prices. $11k Wilier Granturismo is 100% more comfortable than Canyon Endurace (at least the CF SL Di2 I use to ride) and the Dogma I rode in Italy was oddly more comfortable than the Canyon (but I don’t own the Dogma, just rented for a few months). The Canyon was 100% more comfortable than the Trek domaine (entry level).
As for speed, high end bikes have more carbon components than a $4-6k bike, so naturally when you ride a lighter bike you’ll increase your speed to a point. But yes, the thing that makes you faster is you and not necessarily the bike, but having a bike that’s lighter sure does help.
I’m not totally disagreeing with you btw, I think if I could start all over again I would get fitted, buy a carbon frame + fork + saddle post, Ultegra Di2, carbon wheels and handlebar, like $150 saddle, and I’ll be set. Probably cost around $6-8k, and if I went used I could probably get it for $4k.
At the same time, why do people buy a BMW? A car just gets you from point A to point B, why would you spend significantly more when a Honda is more economical and reliable? My point is, people can spend their money how they want and that’s okay. $11k got me the perfect bike and there’s nothing I would change about it and I’ll have it for the rest of my life. It’s just odd to me that people get so abrasive (not you, just in general) about the cost of high end bikes, but a $120k car or truck that’s used to go to the grocery store, nobody bats an eye.
Appreciate the conversation, and I definitely bat an eye at the overpriced mall crawlers people blow absurd amounts of money on to get groceries. I actually do think a $50k car is generally a bit nicer than a 20k car, so in my analogy that could maybe be justified, but $120k is getting a bit silly with marginal gains that are not meaningful (to me at least).
But back to bikes, curious of you’re actually able to compare these bikes you mentioned apples to apples. Same geometry, saddle, tires, grip tape, etc? If it’s frame compliance you’re after, I’m curious for your thoughts on some of the higher end steel frames out there. I ride mostly gravel and am large, so e.g long setback seatposts and 45mm tires soak up everything to the point that frame compliance matters less (but still some of course). I could see that being a bigger deal for smaller/lighter riders though. On the other end of the spectrum for trail bikes the frame just needs to be stiff, so I see zero benefit to carbon there (outside weight of course, but thankfully people learned to care less about weight in the MTB world finally). Back to road I’d also argue aero matters more than those last few grams for just about everything outside of massive climbs. I recall hearing that on any road below 7-8%, aero is still “more important” than weight, meaning you should spend your money there instead. Who knows though, every few years there’s a new trend and every few years I find I value comfort over speed even more.
I just love riding bikes and I spend way too much time learning about tech I have very little desire to actually buy. I’m glad you found a bike you’re super stoked to ride, that’s what that matters at the end of the day!
The Wilier and Canyon are both endurance bikes vs the Pino which is a performance/race. Wilier is still the most comfortable and fast af, but you’re right in that the Canyon was mid-level and has a very different geo so it’s kinda hard to compare-ish. I was actually really surprised at how comfortable the Pino Dogma felt, that would be my go to for races if I owned it.
I actually haven’t ridden any high quality Ti bikes yet, but have heard nothing but great reviews. I’m actually looking at a few companies: No.22, Moots, Seven, and a couple other ti + carbon hybrid. No.22 came out with this new performance bike that they 3D print with very high quality Ti and it’s like $12-15k. You should check out those brands I mentioned, they each have their own custom Ti + Carbon Gravel (or full Ti) builds and it’s not going to hurt the bank account too much (I think $6-8k full build). A couple of friends that ride gravel swear by these hybrid type builds for the exact reasons you mentioned.
You’re username matches your perspective on life
What are your opinions on e-bikes? My wife and I bought them last summer to get more exercise, and I’ve been shocked to see a backlash against them from cyclers (e.g. there’s another comment above saying anything with a motor isn’t a bike).
In my mind, having an e-bike is no different than getting something like a carbon fiber frame. If it makes your biking experience more enjoyable, then great.
This is actually a great question because I don’t really care what bike you’re ridding, as long as your cool, follow road or trail rules, and wave back lol
At the end of the day, as long as you’re having fun and being respectful of other people, you’re cool in my book. I do know what you’re talking about though. I actually went on a cycling tour in Italy last year and on some of the group rides we’d have e-bike road bikes join. There wasn’t an issue but back in America…yea different story
and wave back
Lol my wife and I were joking about that a couple days ago. Reminded us of this old commercial.
Bro, I have “trail friends” which are dudes I just see on the trail and we always wave to each other. I have no idea what their names are but a solid wave back from someone you see semi-regularly that’s grinding —> 👋
I’m living in Denmark. When You walk out the door, you have to watch Your step, not to trip on a bike. When it’s windy, the bikes roll around the streets like tumbleweed.
why am I still faster than u
I dunno, mostly strength, endurance, lung capacity, heart strength, blood pressure, weight, general outlook on life…
I love general outlook on life. Mine always peaks at about the fourth mile on a bike, and hits the lowest valley at the fourtieth mile in a car (though in a car worse means faster.)
My bike was like 50 bucks. It’s shitty but it gets me there. And no one tries to steal it.
It’s definitely not as fast as a fancy road bike though lol.
Mine was $20 from a thrift store, plus maybe $40 in parts. Also a pos, but it’s a pos that will get me there
either of those cost more than my motorcycle.
why the fuck are you guys paying so much for pedal bikes.
Because expensive bicycles are high performance sports gear. You should compare their prices to race ready MX and road motorbikes. $10k bicycle is cheap as fuck, especially when you consider that GP race day tyre set will cost you like $1k alone. For each fucking race day! And then petrol, oil, etc…
I have a fixed gear from state that cost a bit over $500 3 years ago.
It’s my beer and dinner fetching machine. I ride it everyday (the longway) to my local store for ingredients for dinner
3 years and 3000 miles later
I have had to replace 2 chains, 3 rear hubs (my own mistakes… check your lockring or blow up a hub), saddle, grips, cog, lockring, Pedals (went from flats to cages and am now on SPD), replaced original brakes with Shimano brakes and have gone through A LOT of tires.
I think I am in it at like $1500… Tools I don’t want to calculate but building and truing wheels is a very relaxing thing to do
Here’s a picture of it loaded up. I think that I was getting ready for a party
Its pretty anti-fixie
Damn that’s a lot of repairs. Maybe my standards are just low, the old bike I had (3x7 gears) I rode for probably somewhere around half the distance you did, and never changed anything (apart from tires and brake pads), and the bike itself was my old dad’s bike that’s more than 25 years old by now. The 7th gear did start skipping pretty hard by the end tho.
Some of the things I replaced for fun
Some things I broke as I am learning to fix bikes (Hubs mainly… when a cog comes off unexpectedly it usually takes the threads with it)
Others just did wear out that fast… last chain only gave me around 1,000 mi but I rode in a lot of rain / mud and used an awful chain lube. (It was well over 1% out of spec and all winter I had a knocking in my pedal that I just couldn’t figure out)
Pro-tip: buy a £350 bike every 3 years, if you live in the city.
Cons:
- slightly ratchet
Pros:
- can leave it anywhere and it won’t get stolen
- can treat it like shit and it will still keep going
- still beat more than half the spandex babies commuting because they’re afraid to accelerate in case it stretches their chain.
- not afraid to scratch it or take turns at extreme angles.
- no stress when it eventually falls apart
can leave it anywhere and it won’t get stolen
Sadly a £350 bike will also get stolen. Happend to me twice for bikes worth even less 😢
See, your mistake was treating your bike well. The secret is to cover it in grime and piss to the point that even you’re not sure if you want to ride it
Most cities I’ve lived in any bike not locked up will be stolen pretty quickly.
oh no, I mean definitely lock it up. Just expect a lock to do nothing on an expensive bike. A cheap bike? Someone’s coming back for it, it’s not up for grabs, but maybe it’s not worth grabbing
Pro-tip: buy a bike once. It’s not as if they expire or something! There is no good reason a bike shouldn’t last decades and decades, as long as you keep it maintained. My utility bike was manufactured circa 1990, and it works just fine.
(Well, unless it has an aluminum frame, anyway – those really do wear out eventually because aluminum has no fatigue limit.)
They don’t expire, but they do get stolen. Especially if you’re using it to commute.
Depends on what kind of storage infrastructure is available to you. When commuting, I can lock my bike inside a bike room at both ends, which requires a badge to open. The chance of my bike getting stolen on a commute is very slim.
That’s the thing, a back frame bent even just by 3 degrees becomes unsalvageable, and if you’re riding a bike such that you’re not testing the frame to some degree then I’d argue that you’re not riding at all :-P
Every Dutch person in this thread: what the fuck is testing your frame?
going off the road, popping wheelies, carrying heavy parts, cornering at extreme angles with a heavy load, that kind of thing
Steel is real.
I have two bent steel frames from beautiful French bikes that I had to sadly say bye bye to
Bent in which way?
Rear triangle on a steel bike can be straightened out if you are careful.
Front triangle shouldn’t have issues unless it’s bad from the start. (that requires a table and skill)
Only bike I have straightened was a steel huffy (not worth working on)
It had a head tube that was twisted so wasn’t fixable… Rear was easy enough to align though.
Front triangle I just swap out the stem, but back triangle there’s nothing I can do to fix that without weakening the frame even more
My approach to laptop computers
My approach to phones too
Kinda sad that e-scooters (as of like 1-3 years ago), are now cheaper than a decent bike for the same price.
Are more portable tbh. (Especially on the train)
