If Kamala was a garbage candidate, what does that make Trump?
For bonus points, how is it not the voters fault considering any rational answer to the above question? You may open your book to look up topical issues like peace, climate, genocide, rights, hate, juvenile bullying, criminal bullying, felony conviction, bigotry (don’t miss misogyny relating to to “garbage candidate”, see above), and tariffs.
If Kamala was a garbage candidate, what does that make Trump?
The guy who told voters what they wanted to hear. “I know you’re upset at the world, and I’m going to make it great again.”
The best Kamala could do was “I won’t do anything differently from the Biden administration.”
The constant liar who told voters what they wanted to hear.
You and I both know he’s a con artist who won’t fix anything. But when voters don’t feel like the establishment is listening to them, that’s when they become desperate enough to fall for a con artist. Because at least the con artist made them think there was hope.
You can complain about that all you want, but the fact that Bitcoin is reaching new record highs tells me that your average person would rather be conned than be told the truth.
One of these days, the repeatedly record-breaking highs are going to teach those idiots a lesson.
It’s at these levels because cyrpto firms were the largest interest group funneling cash into the 2024 election. it remains nothing more than a bigger fool scam, but this time with the US government’s seal of approval.
Do you disagree that the SEC has been doing an good job with crypto under the Biden administration?
It is utterly wild to me that Biden had to withdraw from the race because he was so unpopular and the Harris team was like, let’s just tie ourselves as snugly to that man as possible. Real brain geniuses on that team. I just read she was relying on a ex uber exec. And it all made sense.
Definitely a catch-22. Throw Biden under the bus and you’ll come across as two-face and people will wonder why you went along with the administration in the first place. Support Biden and his detractors will see no reason to vote for you either.
Having said that, the answer to “what would you do different?” should have never been “id put a Republican in my cabinet.” I think the last 3 weeks of Harris’s campaign is going to go down as one of the biggest fumbles in political history.
Nah, the outcome of the elections was probably determined a year ago. And the fact the billionaire class threw their weight behind Trump, made sure she never had a real chance.
It was determined in 2020. Biden only beat Trump because of covid-19, and was never going to solve the fundamental economic problems that are causing unrest.
And this made it arguably worse cause now they had 4 years to prepare between shifts.
She didn’t have a chance as soon as she gave up trying to convince her base to vote FOR her. Biden got ten million more votes because he lied about reforming the cops, dealing with Covid, not doing genocides in the Middle East, etc. Harris could have fucking lied about those things and won.
Well. And the fact that Biden apparently lied about something that would really kick off in the future shows he had clairvoyance.
But yeah the Dems where not trump, and gave up on arguing things like migration, conceding these points to Trump. And constantly blaring the economy is great while many Americans are hurting bad shows sanders was right. They abandoned the working class. The working class then thought… well at least maga will do something… let’s hope this time it trickles down.
I’ll just wonder how the electorate will fare under trump… I fear worse.
Much worse. Everything Trump has talked about is inflationary and anti worker.
If that’s all it takes, I can do that. Apparently following through doesn’t matter. Though TBF, who actually follows through on most of what they say? 🤷
Turns out, lecturing the voters doesn’t make them want to vote for you. Everything you said is correct, but those weren’t the concerns that resonated. To quote Bill Clinton’s strategist in 92, “it’s the economy, stupid.” Yeah, the economy is doing great right now, but you have to ask, “for who?”
I agree that right now, our economists have a terrible way of defining a “good economy”. They have praise for a set of numbers such as the stock market rates, which have almost no connection to the well-being of common people.
We need more medians and fewer averages; not to measure wealth when it’s spread among the extremes.
It’s not the economy, it’s a popularity contest when the majority of the electorate stop choosing candidates based on what they do and have done and instead only pay attention to what they say or choose based on uninformed vibes.
If Kamala was a garbage candidate, what does that make Trump?
47th President of the USA?
what does that make Trump?
The 47th POTUS.
topical issues like peace, climate, genocide, rights, hate, juvenile bullying, criminal bullying, felony conviction, bigotry
Every single one of those issues was put to measure last week and came up short to “the economy.” Idpol has been the Dem’s running charge since Occupy and has netted them exactly (1) election since Obama’s win as incumbent. It’s just not the winning strategy in national elections.
Even then, Bidens win was despite that, not because of it.
Exactly. Milquetoast old white man got the most votes of any president ever. Work with that.
The COVID situation was so specific that it 1) will never happen again, so don’t count on it, and 2) let a single-issue candidate win.
None of those issues mattered because the US system showed everyone it did not matter.
The system had 4 years to enact any form of consequences and there where none. That MUST mean trump was right and it was all lies and nonsense aimed at discrediting him.
And Trumps campaign ran on idpol this time… is she black? Illegal mexicans in prison getting sex changes, kids getting sex changed… you know, the counter to dem IdPol. They pulled it into the extreme and the Dems took the bait… they did not push back.
With the blatant lies of the magas and their fragile egos… I think the only thing that might have made a difference is call trump fat and stupid, bully him to his face and see if you can make him throw a tantrum or make him cry. Same with Vance… are you wearing eyeliner? Would you not be more comfortable on a couch?
Ok…
Weird this hasn’t come up before for you.
But different people have different standards.
For Republican voters, it’s usually just the letter by someone’s name.
Dem voters have always had higher standards than Republican voters.
For bonus points, how is it not the voters fault
Because the entire point of a candidates campaign is to get votes. And Kamala and her campaign couldn’t even beat fucking trump.
For all those reasons you just listed he’s terrible, Kamala still couldn’t beat him.
What metric do you think a candidate and their campaign should be judged by except number of votes?
Bonus points:
Why don’t you think a shit tier opponent wouldnt make it easier? And how can a candidate who can’t beat trump not be considered “garbage”?
People insisting “no, Kamala Harris was the better candidate!” Are exactly the people this meme are calling out.
Clearly she wasn’t. That doesn’t mean she was a worse human being than Trump. That’s a hard standard to beat. But she was a worse candidate because she lost the election to him, which is the one thing you need to do in order to be the better candidate.
Since the election I’ve written comments the length of essays attempting to explain what you just put so succinctly. “She was a worse candidate because she lost the election to him, which is the one thing you need to do” 100% this.
For what it’s worth, I do try to make the distinction between her and her campaign. She might have been the winning candidate had her campaign made different decisions, but at the end of the day, she’s responsible for her campaign. They can’t force her to say anything she doesn’t want to.
I think there’s a lot of people talking past each other because they don’t agree on what the purpose of being a candidate is. We might think it’s getting elected, others might think it’s being the best representation of the party. Obviously, she wasn’t option 1, but some people may think she was better because they are libs who agree with her ideologically and are somehow still under the delusion that Rs represent state rights, “godliness”, and fiscal responsibility. They see Trump and think “how can people say he’s a better representative of Rs than Kamala is of Ds” and the answer is that they have no idea what Rs want and are incapable of recognizing the broad spectrum of people that normally vote D. I hope people can rid themselves of that kind of thinking because it’s obviously not serving them or the party. Either recognize that candidates need to be ELECTED to mean anything, or be prepared to be in this same position for the foreseeable future.
Unpopular opinion: Kamala was a solid candidate.
Biden was headed to a humiliating defeat. Another couple debates, and maybe he loses NY and CA and we have a Dukakis- or Mondale-level annhilation. Kamala stepped in and ran a solid campaign on very short notice. Trump didn’t even have time to come up with a good nickname for her! She kicked his ass in their only debate, and he was literally too scared to do it again.
In the end, she lost by a couple hundred thousand votes in 3 states. She was wrong about Gaza and the economy, but PA, MI, and WI are credibly winnable in future elections. Kamala was not a garbage candidate.
I think you are partially right. For starters… this was not short notice by any standard. She ran a “solid” campaign.
I’d argue the campaign was flawed because the whole premise was flawed… moving to the right does not help the democratic party. And the risk the Dems now face is that never trumpers join the democratic party and complete the transition of the US electoral system to a choice between maga (Christo fascism) and republican.
If the democratic party had an inkling that the victory of Trump would be as big as is now being said… running Kamala was a doomed endeavor… she was tainted by the Biden years.
What was solid about her? She lost to Trump of all people.
Ask Fox News, they will do their best to give you a fair and balanced assessment of her policies and-
sorry, couldn’t get through that sentence with a straight face.
Honestly, yes. Kamala was the way better choice of the two. Biden kinda fell off for me the moment he did the railroad strike stuff.
But I’m not living in the US, so my point is kinda moot.
Biden got those striking workers everything they wanted. He just didn’t scream about it like Trump would have, which was a huge mistake.
I love you realize this but Harris ended up in a humiliating defeat.
Unpopular opinion: Kamala was a solid candidate.
If that is an unpopular opinion then the statement is definitionally false.
This statement implies popularity = good, universally.
In the 1800s, slavery was popular. Hence, should a candidate have run on preserving slavery?
No it doesn’t. A candidate needs a lot of qualities to be “good”. One of those qualities is the ability to be popular on election day. And unpopular candidate isn’t a good candidate. A popular candidate might be.
Little bit of A, lotta bit of B.
Trump was the most garbage candidate in every way in the history of our country.
He basically coasted to victory.
Double-standards for days.
If candidate 1 is garbage, and candidate 2 loses to candidate 1, what does that say about candidate 2?
That the voters are braindead
Yep. Garbage in, garbage out.
Idiocracy is a documentary.
Though I’ll say it shouldn’t come as a surprise that voters vote against their own interests when the waters of truth are so muddied by the rich and powerful.
That the electorate has been primed to applaud fascistic tendencies as long as they are not called “fascist” by a 24/7 deluge of propaganda networks. The caricature of Harris painted in a phalanx of right-wing disinformation channels looks worse than the picture they painted of Trump. Reality has not had as much impact on this election as one would hope.
This is maddening. It will never stop. The democrats refuse to campaign on progressive policies, which are incredibly popular among the entire electorate (yes, also among republicans, see the recent ballot measures in Missouri on paid sick leave and higher minimum wage, for example), instead opting to position themselves as “republican light”. They completely capitulate to republican messaging on pretty much every issue (border wall, fracking, pro war, etc), and predictably lose to the people who invented this messaging. And then comes the worst part: angry libs start blaming the electorate instead of the people who lost. It’s not the lack of the dems even mentioning universal health care, no it’s the trans people. It’s not the genocide that the current democratic regime is committing, no it’s probably actually latino voters. It’s not the fact that the Harris campaign asks us to pretend everything is hunky spunky with the economy, offering nothing to relieve the 80% of the population who live paycheck to paycheck. Noooo you know what it’s actually white women and muslims faults. You fucking morons.
Can’t wait for the 2026 anti-transgender dem ticket, and the anti gay marriage ticket in 2028. It’s gonna be great.
Money… the big donors won’t let them
If the only reason you voted for trump as a form of ‘punishment’ towards dems, then yea that is on the voters. You should be voting for what helps you. Not to be a petty idiot.
So the action plan is what? Cull the voters? Breed better voters?
The first job of a politician is to reach and convince voters. Harris had a billion dollars and didn’t do it. Yes, the voters made bad choices, but blaming the voters is not a way forward. There is no escaping that we have to figure out what Harris could have done better. More precisely, shitlibs need to figure it out because progressives already know and have been screaming it from the rooftops for decades.
“Jill made bad choices. I blame Bob because he didn’t convince Jill to make a good choice.”
This is such circular fucking reasoning. Apparently it’s literally impossible for a voter to make a stupid decision, because all blame will circle back to the candidate for “Not being convincing enough”.
Here is what you are missing. The point of finding fault is to do better next time. Anything else is just bitching. Yes, the voters got it wrong. Next cycle we will have the same voters and a different candidate. Pretending Harris was a good candidate just invites the same outcome.
Maybe you think the voters are just unreachable. I think that’s nonsense.
I agree; and I personally believe that the fault is with all the voters. All the voters need to do better next time.
There is potential to put yourself in an unmovable situation when you deny the capacity for individuals to find fault in, and correct, themselves. When they’re all “special snowflakes incapable of fault, for whom the horrible and evil politicians must serve to attain their vote” you may set yourself up for either a failing relationship, or lies. Contrary to what one might expect, saying “I’ve heard the opinions of others, and I think I was wrong about X” is not a social death sentence. I’ve said it online before, and others need to be ready to do the same.
Maybe JFK expressed that thought better than I can.
The voters aren’t wrong. It’s the non-voters that are wrong. Democracy should never be collateral for a protest…
EVER.
TBF if we lived in a democracy there would be no protest, because most people want the progressive policies over which they were protesting.
Who here actually votes in more local elections? Have you voted for the mayor or council members of your city? Sheriff? Literally any office lower than governor, senator or president of the entire country?
The top problem (garbage candidates) is literally caused by the bottom one (voters). There is garbage at the top, because nobody cares enough about the bottom.
Then again, it’s not like Trump was ever a politician before running for president…
I am deep in MAGA country (Trump won this county with 70%). All of my local elections are single person.
Before I moved to another city, I seriously thought about running for comptroller in the small town I was in because literally nobody was currently in the position and nobody was running for it. It would have been like a guaranteed win. But then I’d actually have to do the job, and I don’t even know what a comptroller does. Though I suppose it’s not that important, since we didn’t have one. lol
comptrollers are like the field miniboss of accounting.
I do vote in my local elections. I think the problem is actually too much money in politics. The oligarchs support and donate an infinite amount of money to campaigns. That leaves genuine candidates with nothing and little exposure.
I think we should severely limit how much they can donate to campaigns as well as having ranked choice voting, which can help people vote for candidates they like without “throwing” their vote away.
However, the democrats didn’t put up kamala against others in a primary for us to vote for. She was simply selected. Moreover, the last time Bernie ran, the democratic party basically sabotaged him. There are deep issues that we need to solve.
There are deep issues that we need to solve.
None of which will be solved by either party in its current form. Grinding out Democratic Party primary victories is the only shot progressives have in our current system. You can’t change the system without supplanting one of the parties. There is no “going around the DNC” option. We have to take that shit by force.
Cool, so, we’ll see the voters in the primaries going forward, right? Unlike in 2016 and 2020, when they nominated said garbage candidates?
Being a low-information voter doesn’t make your takes correct.
But sure, you saw an emotionally cut video online, so now you’re convinced the DNC stole the primary from the rightful winner.
I’m in California I don’t even get to vote in primaries.
I’m in California I don’t even get to vote in primaries.
what.
California primaries occur on March 5th my incredibly high information friend.
California primaries occur on March 5th my incredibly high information friend.
How does that prevent you from voting in primaries, again?
It means that their vote doesn’t count. I also live in a state that has one of the very last primaries, after the race is already over anyway. By the time I voted for Bernie, he had already dropped out of the race. My vote meant nothing.
By the time I vote in the presidential primary there is typically one name on my ballot.
It’s kinda crazy to me that a sizable amount of people expect a perfect completely spotless candidate, or they don’t vote and hand over the win to fascism.
In a rational world, Harris would have won without even doing a single rally, because the alternative is Trump and his cronies.
People generally don’t realize that the only way to get an option to the left of the democrats is if Republicans no longer win elections. But with each “punishment”, voters give the democrats, the Republicans’ grip on power gets tighter and tighter, with more cronie judges, more gerrymandering, more voter purges, more ID rules, and more propaganda.
So, are the voters, or rather those who didn’t vote, wrong? Fuck yes, for the reason that because of them, we now have Trump as the US president rather than him going to prison like he deserves. Of course they are wrong. How is that even a question?
People generally don’t realize that the only way to get an option to the left of the democrats is if Republicans no longer win elections.
Absofuckinglutely wrong. The number of Democrats still buying this bullshit is astounding. THIS is why you lose so damn much.
No Democratic candidate has had more support from right leaning voters than Bernie Sanders in the last 30 years. Explain that with your model. It’s not just about some smooth gradient from left to right and capturing the middle. We are in a populist age. The people are totally fed up with the status quo.
It’s disruptors that win, not whomever captures the center of a spectrum that only policy wonks even care about. Anyone who’s chief concern is left vs right is already a decided voter.
During Bill Clinton’s first presidential campaign in 1992, he employed a strategy to appeal to moderate and right-leaning voters, which helped him secure support from some traditionally Republican constituencies. Here are key points about Clinton’s approach and support from right-wing voters:
Centrist Positioning
Clinton positioned himself as a “New Democrat,” advocating for centrist policies that appealed to moderate and conservative voters[2]. This included:
- Emphasizing fiscal responsibility and balancing the budget
- Supporting welfare reform
- Taking a tough stance on crime
- Promoting free trade
Targeting Reagan Democrats
Clinton specifically aimed to win back “Reagan Democrats” - working-class white voters who had previously supported Republicans[6]. He focused on economic issues and cultural values that resonated with this group.
“Triangulation” Strategy
Clinton used a strategy of “triangulation,” which involved:
- Distancing himself from traditional liberal Democratic positions
- Adopting some conservative policy stances
- Positioning himself between the liberal wing of the Democratic Party and Republicans[7]
Appeal to Suburban Voters
Clinton made significant inroads with suburban voters, including many who had previously voted Republican[2]. His moderate positions on social and economic issues appealed to this demographic.
Breaking the “Republican Lock”
Clinton’s strategy helped him win states that had been part of the Republican “lock” on the Electoral College, including Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin[6].
While Clinton did not win a majority of right-wing voters, his centrist approach and focus on economic issues allowed him to peel away enough support from traditionally Republican constituencies to win the election. This strategy was controversial within the Democratic Party but proved effective in the general election[2][7].
Citations: [1] An examination of the 2016 electorate, based on validated voters https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2018/08/09/an-examination-of-the-2016-electorate-based-on-validated-voters/ [2] Controversy: Why Did Clinton Win? - The American Prospect https://prospect.org/power/controversy-clinton-win/ [3] In Their Own Words: Why Voters Support – and Have Concerns About https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2016/09/21/in-their-own-words-why-voters-support-and-have-concerns-about-clinton-and-trump/ [4] Basket of deplorables - Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basket_of_deplorables [5] Governing in an Age of No Majorities: Bill Clinton’s mission for a … https://www.brookings.edu/articles/governing-in-an-age-of-no-majorities-bill-clintons-mission-for-a-second-term/ [6] Here’s how Democrats have changed since the Bill Clinton era https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-opinion/democratic-party-dnc-bill-clinton-era-changes-rcna166669 [7] Bill Clinton: Campaigns and Elections | Miller Center https://millercenter.org/president/clinton/campaigns-and-elections [8] Don’t understand Trump supporters? Remembering Bill Clinton … https://kansasreflector.com/2024/08/03/dont-understand-trump-supporters-remembering-bill-clinton-might-help-you/
That’s an impressive writeup. Here is the problem. This is 2024, not 1992. Clinton’s strategy has not aged well.
2008 - Hillary and McCain both ran a centrist strategy and lost to Obama who ran as a disruptor. Obama gets a mandate.
2010 - Democrats lose Congress and the mandate on a centrist strategy.
2012 - Obama almost loses to Mit Romney with both running centrist strategies.
2016 - Hillary loses on a centrist strategy against Trump who is clearly not a centrist.
2020 - Biden barely moves towards a disruptor position and barely beats Trump who should have been easily beatable.
2024 - Need I say it?
Good luck with shaming people into voting for you. It didn’t work in 2016 and it didn’t work now. Letting the DNC off the hook won’t change anything.
It can be both.
This, but unironically.
Trump was so bad that in a sane world a desiccated cat turd shoukd have beat him
The fact Harris lost doesn’t mean shes a bad candidate, it means we don’t live in a sane world.
Yeah I agree, it’s the voters who are wrong. Can’t wait to see how this strategy pans out next cycle!
Honestly, the voters voted in a way that made sense, given the information they had, which was either nothing - complete and utter lethargy, or a hyper-partisan distortion of reality reinforced by a multi-billion dollar propaganda industry backed by, among many others, the literally richest man on the planet in addition to an entire network of propaganda stations blasting disinformation 24/7. The voters being wrong is intentional and has been in the making for decades.
They did vote in a way that makes sense. The Harris campaign offered nothing in the way of economic relief, while committing genocide. That’s an insanely bad proposition. Stop blaming voters and look at your dogshit candidates.
Be honest: you claim that Harris offers no economic relief because you yourself never bothered to look up her actual policies and you’ve been told that she has none. It’s wild to even compare anything she’s proposed to Trump’s economic policies and conclude that she offers the general populace less when all Trump has done is to massively shift wealth from the bottom to the top and will most likely continue to do just that.
Name them.
Go to her fucking policy page and read them. They’re still there. Off the top of my head, additional support for parents, anti-gouging laws limiting price hiking, tax incentives for creation of more housing supply, among others that were expressly mentioned by her and can still be found on hee campaign page.
Trump offered less than nothing in the way of economic relief and he will accelerate the genocide. The voters didn’t vote in a way that makes sense, and that is Harris’s fault.
Being right doesn’t automatically make you popular.
Apparently it does on the right.
I mean, yes, the over 70 million voters who voted for Trump absolutely are wrong. That they’re mostly too willfully fucking stupid to understand that may speak to a failure in Harris’ messaging, but nevertheless does not absolve them of the guilt of being willfully dumb as fucking rocks.
Harris had concrete plans to tackle many, though not all, of the issues people actually care about. People voted for the man openly stating he will make those issues worse.
It’s blatantly the fault of the voters. Until you people can get your heads out of your asses and join us in reality nothing will change.
Truth. We definitely need to nominate better voters next cycle.
No she hasn’t.
Right, so you expect me to believe that your own wilful ignorance is also her fault?
‘No it isn’t’ without any citations is the laziest response ever and earns you my ‘disregard opinions’ tag next to your username
Perfection is the enemy of progress.
I can tell that many people in these comments have given up on every artistic skill they’ve ever tried to learn because their attempts were never good enough right out of the gate.
Um…
the voters kinda did the nominating…
Edit: To clarify what I mean. People who voted in the Democratic primary didn’t exactly vote for Biden, but voted for delegates that pledge to vote to Biden at the convention. Those delegates then can vote for who they think the people who voted for them would want when Biden dropped out. The delegates decided the voters would’ve wanted Harris since shes the VP, and that’s probably what the voter would’ve want.
If you argue that Biden only won the 2024 nomination because of 2020. Well yea voters voted for him in 2020 too. 🤷♂️
People need to vote in primaries.
That doesn’t sound like a very democratic process to begin with cause all the power is in the delegates who can just choose whoever they want and not follow the desires of the voters. Which is how pretty much the whole system works to begin with, so its pretty rotten even at the very bottom
It doesn’t sound democratic because thats is what America is. This system of an intermediate group of people between voters and the electer official is why America is the way is is today. ahem Electoral College ahem
If trump wasn’t elected president in 2016, we would not even have this fascist mess to begin with.
Trust me I know. I’m saying voting in the primaries wouldn’t change anything. The only fix is to destroy the systems that let this happen in the first place. Capitalism and government
