The animating concept behind the Trump campaign will be chaos. This is what history shows us fascists do when given the chance to participate in democratic political campaigns: They create chaos. They do it because chaos works to their advantage. They revel in it, because they can see how profoundly chaos unnerves democratic-republicans—everyone, that is, whether liberal or conservative, who believes in the basic idea of a representative government that is built around neutral rules. Fascism exists to pulverize neutral rules.
So they campaign with explicit intention to instill a sense of chaos. And then comes the topper: They have the audacity to insist that the only solution to the chaos—that they themselves have either grossly exaggerated or in some cases created!—is to vote for them: “You see, there is nothing but chaos afoot, and only we can restore order!”
I’m tired of every election being the most important election. I want politics to be boring again, less evil too if possible.
If politics were ever boring or less evil, it’s because you weren’t paying attention or engaged. Every upcoming election will always be the most important. Simply because all the others have happened, and the remainder are too far off and nebulous.
Ask all the people suppressed, attacked, and assassinated in the 50s and 60s fighting for civil rights. All the ones since then too. It didn’t magically become perfect. Or all the people brutalized by robber barons before as they fought for unions, weekends, reasonable hours, and basic safety.
Being disengaged from politics is a luxury and a privilege that most people can’t afford. Which explains why we’re in such a deficit. With so much of the American population chomping at the bit for fascism again. And much of the rest of the world close behind. Putin in Russia, Orban in Hungary, Milieu in Argentina, etc etc etc. We’ve been asleep at the wheel, enabling the worst people among us.
You landed in the wrong timeline.
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Too late for that.
Republicans are pushing for fascism, and Democrats like not having to do anything but be second worst to fascists.
It might be a few elections before that happens. There’s political turmoil and fascists have a chance so they’re gonna keep going for it until republicans understand they cannot possibly win anything with fascism
Yeah the problem is that wide reaching policy changes is hard to sell on a country wide scale
Are the Democrats EVER prepared though?
“I am not a member of any organized political party. I am a Democrat.” - Will Rogers, 1879-1935
“Democrats never agree on anything, that’s why they’re Democrats. If they agreed with each other, they’d be Republicans.” - Will Rogers, 1879-1935
1879-1935
TIL you guys have been stuck with the same two political parties since the 1850s. No wonder they’ve gone a bit corrupt.
To be fair, the parties themselves have changed significantly since then.
To be fair, no two-party system is a healthy democracy, and the way our elections are designed it’ll stay that way.
Our election system is generally bad. Elections aren’t controlled by the federal government, even for federal elections, they are run by counties (or whatever the locality calls a county - in Louisiana they are parishes) and each county runs their elections differently unless the state steps in and regulates it. Some states have mail in voting, some make you stand in line on election day. Some counties have FPTP voting, others might have STAR or RCV.
The only way I see things changing at all are two fold: publicly funded elections with no private money at all AND abandoning FPTP voting for a broader method with an added benefit of potentially eliminating primaries. I know parties would complain, but things would be much more democratic.
This is entirely correct. The only way to heal the nation is to take steps forward, not relying on an archaic system that ‘works’ and building out something that actually works.
We won’t get rid of FPTP or gerrymandering so long as we elect our representatives from geographically defines districts. We should empanel state congressional delegations in statewide elections, rather than by districts.
In a state with 20 congressional seats, any party that wins at least 5% of the vote should have a seat. A party that wins 10% of the vote should have 2 seats.
Which means, get worse
Yep, as it has been since the 1850s
Yep, as it has been since the 1850s
since the 1850s
Yeahhh, you may find some people disagree with you on that one. I hear some stuff happened in 1861-1865 or something, for example.
America’s founders biggest fear were political factions forming. But when they were concerned the voters were all landowning men, how could people with shared economic interests ever form factions?
That’s what happens with a first past the post voting system. A ranked choice would open things up quite a bit, but that would require the people elected by the first past the post voting system to change it or mass revolution.
Someone call the French and let them know we actually do need them again.
It must be a proportional system. No other system produces viable 3rd parties.
No other system produces viable 3rd parties.
American’s lack of knowledge about Canada never ceases to amaze me.
Canada has effectively the same system as the UK, both being based on fptp, are you suggesting that fptp is fine in a preliminary system?
I’ve campaigned for an NDP candidate who was against fptp as many of us are, even our current PM ran on replacing fptp which never happened of course… however we have more than 2 “viable” parties despite not having proportional representation. You can apply definitions to “viable” at your will but they have won provinces quite recently and have many seats in federal and provincial government.
I looked over and the trend is away from two parties as well.
Americans are perfectly capable of manufacturing guillotines domestically.
Yeah, but the French guillotines have that certain je ne said quoi.
God damn it. It’s been true that long?
It’s almost like individual people have different opinions and want different things.
…yeah…but also, we all need to want Republicans to lose spectacularly.
It increasingly feels like that’s the single unifying trait holding the democratic party together. That’s the sole reason you see people telling everyone to get out and vote.
It’s not “We need to get young people to vote because they care about progressive policies, and we can elect a candidate who will align with their views”, it’s “We need to get young people to vote because we can’t let Trump win another term.”
Because it is the only trait. The Democrats know it. As long as they act slightly more progressive they can enjoy massive corporate and AIPAC bribes just like the Republicans do.
Nothing will change if people vote Democrat this time. In 2028 some other Republican (or Trump again) will run and the Dems will go “Vote for us or we’re going to get Genocided for real this time unlike the other 150 last years whenever a Republican won”
The Democrats are actually way more internally organized now. About 30 years ago during the 90s both parties reached almost unanimous internal ideological consensus’ and essentially all vote as a single blocks. The state we’re in now with this polarization is part of this, and an example of the increased factionalization of US politics.
It’s crazy to think how there were staunch segregationist Democrats in to the 70s even as the party as a whole had been (successfully) catering to younger urban demographics that came alongside industrialization. We can’t really imagine something like that occurring now. Even Biden was opposed to bussing and a lot of his “across the aisle” examples even today involve working with segregationist Democrats, not “across the aisle” as we interpret it now.
I actually like that about the Democrat Party. Shows how ideologically diverse it is because tolerance is a bedrock of the party ever since the two parties switched from being conservative and liberal. The GOP flipped within four years from being neocons to isolationists, and anyone who disagrees with the current identity is a RINO
"Ten degrees to the left of center in good times, ten degrees to the right when it affects them personally.’ - Phil Ochs, 1966
Democrats and Republicans swapped ideologies and beliefs around 1936
This has been the Republican Party’s M.O. for decades.
“Government is corrupt and ineffective, elect us and we’ll prove it to you!”
I really wish Biden would step down. I’d love a better option from the Dems. That said, no way in hell am I voting for Trump.
I really wish Biden would step down. I’d love a better option from the Dems.
glances at Kamala Harris
sighs
Biden is safe, and honestly the best frontrunner we have.
I disagree. An 80 year old is not the best option we have.
Certainly the best option who’s running though
That’s 11 months for heart disease to do the world a favor and get itself some good PR for once.
There is no saving America, there’s only buying time. Democrats can’t do what’s needed to prevent fascism because actually doing something about the Republican party would risk creating actual democracy. Prepare to fight fascism now because at best you’re buying yourself another 4 years. Vote, don’t vote, vote for a third party out of protest, whatever you do organize with other people and prepare for the worst.
In the best case, I’m wrong and you’ve made new friends. But if you don’t organize now it will be too late to organize in the worst case.
Democrats can’t do what’s needed to prevent fascism because actually doing something about the Republican party would risk creating actual democracy.
Hard fucking facts. When you look at places where liberals have carte blanche to do whatever they damned well please - your Californias and Washingtons and NYs and Minnesotas - they still can’t bring themselves to do what needs doing. No public health care. Rampant homelessness thanks to commodified housing. Food deserts. Rich-people-only universities. No new mass transit. Police budgets skyrocketing. Everyone kowtowing to tech executives for no discernible benefit.
Meanwhile, the fascists in Texas and Florida and the Dakotas and Carolinas are creating the future of the American political system while Schumer, Jeffries, and Biden just kinda sleep through it.
Vote, don’t vote, vote for a third party out of protest, whatever you do organize with other people and prepare for the worst.
Voting as a panacea for organizing has really fucked the country as a whole. While movement conservatives raid school boards and throw pipe bombs at abortion clinics and do Brooks Brothers Riots and Jan 6ths any time an election is in doubt, liberals have been totally pacified. They show up ever couple of years, pull a lever, do a thoughts and prayers, and go home.
They spend far more time gambling on Robinhood or working overtime to earn their bosses a bigger paycheck than they do throwing events for their neighborhood or organizing their offices to bargain for a bigger share of company profits.
The American future looks increasingly grim.
When voting isnt enough learn how to grow crops like a farmer not a gardener and then practice shooting. If we’re lucky those will stay hobbies.
learn how to grow crops like a farmer
Historically, the smart move it own the land and have other people do the reaping and sowing. Even then, agricultural land has skyrocketed in cost as its been commodified. Idk if I’d consider “sharecropper” a savvy career change under and social conditions.
practice shooting
At whom? Or is the plan to just shoot everything that moves and hope for the best?
If you have enough money to hire people to do farmwork this comment is not for you. It’s about you.
If you don’t have enough money to hire people to do farmwork, you sure as hell don’t have enough money to purchase productive farmland.
No on said to buy a farm. Use what’s available to you and ammend the soil, there are plenty of organic addatives that are free, low cost, or byproducts. Also make you own compost to continually add neutrients, aka grow food like a farmer not a gardener.
The point is to know how to do it cyclically, with little if any input other than what you create. Its an investment in divesting from society, and a lesson in sufficience that you may need once the fact that China and Bill Gates own the most farmland in America becomes a more pressing issue.
The guns are there because for any situation where food become that valuable, productive land anywhere becomes a target. Weather its pests, deers, boars, or humans.
Use what’s available to you and ammend the soil
A quarter acre of land in my neighborhood runs for $300k. There is nothing I can do to that soil that’s going to justify a $300k upfront investment in urban agriculture. Nevermind what this prepper nonsense is going to accomplish in the event the End of The World isn’t happening within the next five years.
a lesson in sufficience that you may need once the fact that China and Bill Gates own the most farmland in America becomes a more pressing issue.
The cool thing about farmland is that its only really useful if its being worked. And the realization that we’re ultimately going to have to come to terms with is that the folks who “own” the land are very far removed from the folks who give the land value.
At the same time, subsistence farming isn’t a particularly productive lifestyle in a post-industrial world. So telling everyone to run out to Iowa and become soybean farmers is not good financial advice.
True, that. Building mutually supportive communities is really beneficial if shit goes bad. It’s something most of us can do on a local level and it’s something most humans are pretty good at.
Gods know I’m not ready for another American election.
You and me, both.
Democrats still don’t know who they will be running against - since the polling needed to determine that are not “likely Iowa caucus goers” but “likely Trump jurors”. We don’t want to be like the Republicans in 2008 who were completely prepared to take on and tear down a Hilary Clinton nominee, only to find themselves fighting Obama.
If the Republican nominee is anyone but Trump, we’ll see Trump run as an independent and split the vote.
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I would hate to see how that voter turnout would affect all the downballot elections.
Him running from jail while competing against a candidate that isn’t popular with the MAGA nuts, would be the ideal outcome.
The world will be looking at you. Don’t fuck this up USA
Too late. We’ve already normalized fascism.
Fascism makes people turn on the tv, so every national news network actively did that for the profit of it.
Too late.
A lot of wackos around the world have been winning elections, so we shall see.
I wouldn’t be surprised if more vicious rhetoric has been used in past elections, at least one candidate in pre-Civil War America was called a “hermaphrodite”, but the inevitable use of AI is going to make the election an absolute circus. L
Meet the new year, same as the old year.
Please, for the love of God; if it’s a state where Biden is guaranteed, then vote third party or whatever alternative dumbass you want. If it’s a swing state, it’s your god damned duty to vote for Biden. I don’t like the AID he’s providing Israel but he’s not dropping the fucking bombs.
We don’t need to spit in the face of our constitution to prove a point. We don’t need to tank the work he’s done getting the country back on track so you can feel morally superior. We don’t need another bad year of COVID just because your friends are saying “Biden bad”. Your friends are retarded and so are you.
Normally I don’t give a shit what you liberal idiots do but this is seriously going to affect us in the real world. It’s not your reddit and lemmy echo chambers out here so please tighten the fuck up.
Or tell us of a viable, alternative candidate with over a 90% chance of winning. Oh you don’t have one? Then please shut the fuck up and vote Biden.
Agree basically but why use slur?
It’s BIDENS BOMBS being dropped from BIDENS AIRPLANES. The fact that the pilot is israeli would only matter if Biden STOPPED SENDING THEM MORE BOMBS AND AIRPLANES.
Genocide Joe has got to go!
Since you seem to love concern trolling, please explain why you’d prefer a literal xenophobic dictator who gets off to torturing minorities
Checks news.
Biden sends Israel more bombs
No. No they are not.
The illusion of choice: vote for a senile old man or a senile old man that would consider turning minorities into Big Macs because he is hungry
The while calling Biden senile thing is pretty worn out. It’s not true and it only helps Trump. Yeah, he’s old, but Biden is sharper now than Trump was 30 years ago.
What about the 40 beheaded babies that Biden saw photographic evidence of?
Biden is the dullest tool in the shed.
You think Biden is a duller tool than the guy who suggested injecting beach to fight COVID and wanted to nuke a hurricane?
the he’s better than Trump thing is worn out. Don’t worry I’ll vote for grandpa Joe, I mean, what choice do I have?
Hey man, just look at China, the much darker truth is that in many parts of the world, senile old men run things, your freedom, dreams and purpose is largely meaningless to them unless they’re very close to you or you’ve shown that you also care about their freedom and the well-being of their future offspring.
For a lot of older people, a certain cynicism comes with wisdom, and you’re just like everyone else, a cog in the wheels of a big system. For America and China, where in many parts it’s essentially still a mafia state, this is even more pronounced for people that come into positions of power at an older age as they’re even more experienced at the real life equivalent to GTA politics.
The only real upside is that it’s not as bad as the middle east still but hey that’s a low bar for most that consider war and civil society to be two separate states of existence
Don’t forget, both those old men want Genocide in Palestine. I’m hoping more people vote 3rd party this year
…which will only help the fascists and put donnie into power.
Someone in another thread asked me what was the difference between coalition governments and two party systems. This is it. You should never be forced to vote against a candidate, yet that has been the US for the last several elections and will continue to be the US for the foreseeable future. Unless Trump wins, then the last vestiges of democracy in the US will fall pretty hard as Trump and associates continue to stuff cronies into government and finishing what they started during his first presidency while Europe and Asia likely fall to military conflicts.
I’m hoping more people vote 3rd party this year
Why would that accomplish something in 2024 when it didn’t accomplish anything with Nader in 2000 or Perot in 1992? The Democrats and Republicans will really definitely for sure learn their lesson this time for realsies?
Nobody learned any lessons. If they did Trump wouldn’t have been elected let alone be allowed to run again after provoking an insurrection to stay in power. I want to see viable 3rd party challenges that can make for actual change in how this current system work. People need options that don’t completely suck
I want to see viable 3rd party challenges that can make for actual change in how this current system work.
Who would this viable third party challenger be and why would they be able to make actual change when neither Perot nor Nader could?
Don’t strawman the idea of 3rd party candidates. Just fall in line is not really a healthy mindset if change is desirable. Humans could never fly until they actually tried
Very sadly we just aren’t in a climate for third party candidates to do anything. I would suggest getting involved with ranked choice voting advocacy groups if you really believe in it.
This is the perfect climate for it. Teach the Democrat voters that these Zionist Nazi foreign agents have no place in politics. Either they all join in third party voting or they’ll keep losing to Republicans.
Trump winning again isn’t going to change anything. The “he’s a dictator and never going to step down” fear mongering from last time turned out to be complete BS.
Nothing will ever change if you guys keep acting like scared chickens refusing to vote for anything other than Democrats.
Democrats are the controlled opposition, nothing more.
How do you expect to see a viable third party challenge in the US with our current system? All third parties do is get the major party most opposed to their position elected because it don’t matter jack shit if 51 people vote against Orange Hitler if 3 of them vote ‘Principled Third Party’, leaving only 48 people to vote for the major party candidate opposed to Orange Hitler. Orange Hitler wins 49-48-3, and all 51 people who didn’t want Orange Hitler get stuck with him because 3 didn’t want Grandpa Joe. Leave off with the Rebellion for now, and spend your effort on replacing First Past the Post. Until you do that, all you’ll do is ensure we get Orange Hitler.
I don’t think either of them cares much about the middle east or Israel much. If anything they both look at Benjamin the same way Xi looks at the DPRK guy.
Just old upstarts with bones to pick over
